A Poll on VMP Thread Consolidation

How many VMP threads should there be in the Vinyl Clubs forum?

  • Five threads - one for each track, one for the store (exclusives, swaps, etc.), one for anthology

    Votes: 235 84.8%

  • One thread - all VMP related threads in the clubs forum merged into one

    Votes: 42 15.2%
  • Total voters
    277
  • Poll closed .
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Not open for further replies.
jaycee said:
I'm not sure there's a reasonable place to post this but this thread seemed to make some sense.

This isn't about VMP thread consolidation. I don't think that's a driving issue, but there has been an increased toxicity and hostility around the forum that most often rears its ugly head in the VMP threads. The spillover of people from reddit coming here to complain about VMP and about the reddit threads isn't helping, but I don't even think it's isolated to the VMP threads. It's spilling over into a lot of corners of N&G.

I know one person's joke or inane comment is another person's bullying or attack. It's kind-of unfortunate that these short quips are how we all communicate with each other. There's a lot of interpretation that happens between the words being typed, posted, read (more likely skimmed) and processed, and we all take ourselves too seriously sometimes.

The community here, the people that actually get what that word means and believe in it, remains. There have been far more acts of kindness, generosity, and just general caring about your fellow humans than shitty behavior, but the negativity is often louder and easier to focus on. Still, when I see long term community members leaving or considering leaving do to the onslaught of negativity I think it's something to be concerned about.

I don't know what the exact issue is, maybe there isn't one, and I'm not sure there's anything in particular to be done anyway.

VMP is a place to buy records, that's it. I know it means more to some people and less to others. I think the basic truth is that it's a company that mostly presses variants of records and re-releases some others. It doesn't need to be any more than that.

Complain about them if you must. Make fun of them if you must. It sure is easy to do. The frustration that often gets converted to anger isn't unjustified. BUT can we be a little less shitty to each other? Thankfully we have ignore options for individuals and threads. Just turn them off and do your best to disengage (easier said than done). It's cool. We aren't all going to like each other and sometimes you just need a break from other people's vibes. This isn't a situation that the mods can warn, ban, or discuss our way out of. We need to police ourselves - you know like people that aren't emotional children (I know easier said than done again).

For some of us VMP started this whole thing where we can get together in a safe space to chat about music or whatever else and maybe even make a friend or two. Others of us came around later once the company started to become more of a company and less of a community. Still others came along even more recently after the company kicked it's most loyal customers out for being a little too loud about all of their fuck-ups.... and there are many many more people who just buy there records to flip them or have them or whatever and never go online to talk about the company that refuses to grow-up.

I don't really have a point but if i do maybe it's that we all choose to view VMP however we want, and it's not our job to impose that perspective on anyone else. If you love em great. If you hate em great. If you're anywhere in-between then great. It doesn't matter. It's just someplace to buy records, and none of us need to care about where other people by their records.

Express that you love them. Express that you hate them. Express that you're indifferent. It's just someplace to buy records (insert jab about if they ever delivered them or not here).

Whatever your deal is, whatever your viewpoint on that company or any other, whatever reasons or lack thereof you are on this forum - shitting on each other because you disagree or you think you're right or you think that the other person is dumb, or you're just super unaware of your own anger issues isn't adding anything, and maybe it's making this place less welcoming than it's intended to be.... and coming here to complain because screaming into your keyboard on reddit or any other forum wasn't emotionally satisfying is pretty fucking lame.

Let's stop making N&G about that company. Let's make 2020 the year that indifference about VMP becomes the norm and not the exception. Maybe then we just hang-out and bullshit and let this place be whatever it's going to be.
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Yeah, I've felt a bit more hostility/toxicity creeping in here as well, and it's bumming me out. I appreciate you posting this.
 
VMP and non-VMP, live together in perfect harmony, side by side on my computer keyboard oh lord why can’t we. Yes the Exclusives thread has a lot of VMP bashing but I haven’t heard people bashed for being fans still. For example @NathanRicaud is still excited to be a member and still gets a positive reaction from the likes of @Dead C and @Joe Mac (and he has a reason to be angry. VMP hurt him. They hurt him bad). Maybe the post is more an outline to the newer members than the older ones who have always been tolerant of differences in opinion.
 
Murfocakes said:
VMP and non-VMP, live together in perfect harmony, side by side on my computer keyboard oh lord why can’t we. Yes the Exclusives thread has a lot of VMP bashing but I haven’t heard people bashed for being fans still. For example @NathanRicaud is still excited to be a member and still gets a positive reaction from the likes of @Dead C and @Joe Mac (and he has a reason to be angry. VMP hurt him. They hurt him bad). Maybe the post is more an outline to the newer members than the older ones who have always been tolerant of differences in opinion.
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how dare you suggest that I tolerate other human beings...

Also that is for the invite another VMP thread to add to the ignore list, if people would stop tagging me I might be able to pretend that we’d never granted them undeserved space...

Also advert time. N&G AoTMS, better music, no FOMO, real love.
 
oldschoolkirby said:
Yeah, I've felt a bit more hostility/toxicity creeping in here as well, and it's bumming me out. I appreciate you posting this.
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Yep. I haven't seen hostility as much as basic negativity in the areas I used to visit. I get it, it is the internet and arguments are generally the norm, but, this was always a place that was pretty positive for the most part.
 
Joe Mac said:
how dare you suggest that I tolerate other human beings...

Also that is for the invite another VMP thread to add to the ignore list, if people would stop tagging me I might be able to pretend that we’d never granted them undeserved space...

Also advert time. N&G AoTMS, better music, no FOMO, real love.
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As I said, they hurt him. They really hurt him.
 
goodoohuru said:
I think this place is still very positive. This is a unique situation where a bunch people from the same place, with similar interests have all experienced a natural disaster together and can appreciate and share each others grief.
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When I was 20, I had my wisdom teeth pulled out without anaesthetic and laughed maniacally the whole time to the dismay of the horrified dental assistant. The dumpster fire keeps me warm.

I feel like there's less conflict than I do when the masses want to silence a person dealing with issues, they don't personally have to deal with them an it feels "negative." Right now, EVERYONE is dealing with problems related to that company. I feel the whole, "well... mine works" attitude is more dismissive and negative than a collective dealing with and laughing it off together, but I guess that's all subjective, too. Again, I'm not seeing or recognizing the attacks. I personally addressed two different situations on here that I felt were unfairly coming at a member and reddit mod and each of the people involved actually owned it, agreed personal attacks were unwarranted, and apologized. I NEVER see that happen.

Mostly, I'm seeing folks make tons of jokes in the middle of a shitstorm and laughing through it. I guess other options are to leave the thread dead or to pretend everything is going smooth. Both seem a little absurd to me. That thread is for updates and all the updates have been pretty much bad news for customers lately. Even if you're posting about store drops, then you're still talking about Still Woozy and another fiasco. Is the hope that everyone does a fake tea party with the records they haven't received, eating imaginary food like a scene from HOOK?

There used to be two factions. The, "You're over reacting and being too harsh. If you don't like VMP you should leave or keep it to yourself" crew. And the, "Hey. They just did something kind of fucked up to me" people with concerns. It's the same as with the end of the forum. I've said it repeatedly, but this place is all of those people in varying degrees of frustration or support for VMP being put in a situation so undeniable that it united us.

Anyone that says N&G is generally more positive than the old forum has to recognize the one major difference, VMP is relegated to a corner of this place and doesn't run it. That's also why some of us argued to minimize its presence. It's definitely not an argument for more space for them.

But, in the end, this place is called Needles & Grooves. It's still a record forum and, if Newbury or Colemine or Fatbeats or any other club or company was melting down like this -- especially one that has thousands of dollars and pounds and toonies in members money and unfulfilled orders unaccounted for -- there is zero chance that we wouldn't be discussing it and following along intently. I guess the question is if you think VMP is being unfairly singled out because of our history with them, or if they are being unfairly defended and treated differently for the same reason.

I want the Fiona record I've been promising my baby's mama for 2.5 years and I want my Danny Brown, etc. But I'm laughing through it. If I'm making other people sad, let me know. This all seems really vague and broad and the stories of negativity and attacks don't ring true to me. If I understood them more or what they're referencing, then maybe I would get it and I'd be happy to help and support this message.
 
Teeeee said:
Motion to revisit this please?

We're the N&G forum. No other club has as many threads as VMP. I have more thoughts but won't spew them if this is not a discussion we want to re-open. Hopefully it can be a civil and rational discussion. :)
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Personally, I’d keep it as is. My two cents is if people don’t want to read about VMP, people don’t have to go into those threads. There are tons of other good threads on here so that keeps me busy and I can dip in and out of the VMP threads if I want to know what the upcoming albums are. Consolidating it to one VMP thread would be a shit show. There’s a good amount of people here who are still members and having the separate threads is still useful IMO.
 
MikeH said:
Personally, I’d keep it as is. My two cents is if people don’t want to read about VMP, people don’t have to go into those threads. There are tons of other good threads on here so that keeps me busy and I can dip in and out of the VMP threads if I want to know what the upcoming albums are. Consolidating it to one VMP thread would be a shit show. There’s a good amount of people here who are still members and having the separate threads is still useful IMO.
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I agree with this. There's plenty of threads which I never pop into as its just not a topic that appeals to me or that im interested in. I don't mind them being there as I know other people do use it. I actually use most of the VMP threads regularly. Having them consolidated into one would make it incredibly difficult to keep track of whats actually happening really.
 
MikeH said:
Personally, I’d keep it as is. My two cents is if people don’t want to read about VMP, people don’t have to go into those threads. There are tons of other good threads on here so that keeps me busy and I can dip in and out of the VMP threads if I want to know what the upcoming albums are. Consolidating it to one VMP thread would be a shit show. There’s a good amount of people here who are still members and having the separate threads is still useful IMO.
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Valid points. But VMP *is* a shit show so why should it be any different here? Lol

I do see you in other threads and I appreciate that. I want to interact with my fellow forumers outside of the VMP threads because some of us don't like thing. Perhaps my desire is fueled by the members that don't ever go into any thread that doesn't have VMP on it. I saw people saying in a VMP thread that they missed clues and guessing. Um? We have that. Do you have any ideas to get people involved in the other threads outside of VMP?
 
Selaws said:
I agree with this. There's plenty of threads which I never pop into as its just not a topic that appeals to me or that im interested in. I don't mind them being there as I know other people do use it. I actually use most of the VMP threads regularly. Having them consolidated into one would make it incredibly difficult to keep track of whats actually happening really.
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Why is it up to N&G to keep track of everything on behalf of VMP? Why are you all so willing to do that work for them for free?
 
Teeeee said:
Valid points. But VMP *is* a shit show so why should it be any different here? Lol

I do see you in other threads and I appreciate that. I want to interact with my fellow forumers outside of the VMP threads because some of us don't like thing. Perhaps my desire is fueled by the members that don't ever go into any thread that doesn't have VMP on it. I saw people saying in a VMP thread that they missed clues and guessing. Um? We have that. Do you have any ideas to get people involved in the other threads outside of VMP?
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I should add that there are some members that I truly enjoy interacting with but the only place they visit is the VMP threads. So it forces me to choose between interacting with friends in those threads I don't like (and you all probably don't care for me to enter because my opinions are well known at this point) or never interacting with those friends. :( It's not a fun choice to make.
 
Teeeee said:
Why is it up to N&G to keep track of everything on behalf of VMP? Why are you all so willing to do that work for them for free?
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It's not up to N&G and I doubt anyone is arguing otherwise but it certainly seems like forum members want to keep track and discuss things happening with VMP, good and bad.
 
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