Vinyl Me Please Essentials

Sonicpharmacist said:
Hole, maybe Weezer are “unimportant“ in terms of how music has evolved in general (I could be swayed with Weezer). However, Green Day is not. Dookie dramatically changed the landscape of music in the 90s.
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I don't really think it did. I really think it was the final death knoll in actual punk music, opening the doors to pop punk to take over. Even so, I don't think they changed music (good or bad) for the long term. Anything Green Day did is not more important or lasting then say The Clash, The Ramones, Sex Pistols or even Joy Division. Dookie being an "important" album to the 90's (again I'd debate this - I don't think it added anything to the conversation) does not equate to Green Day being important to music.
 
I mean, whomever signed them to Reprise and put major label money behind them is more important then they are. Although, honestly, A&R doing that has more to do with the band that made Bleach becoming a huge thing than Green Day per se. Nirvana is an important band and to not include them in the pop punk equation sort of ignores their roots. Nirvana had more to do with punk becoming pop than Dookie. Dookie is just the zeitgeist moment when the public went "hey punk is a thing. I like thing." They then quickly ruined it with Blink 182. lol
 
Sonicpharmacist said:
Hole, maybe Weezer are “unimportant“ in terms of how music has evolved in general (I could be swayed with Weezer). However, Green Day is not. Dookie dramatically changed the landscape of music in the 90s.
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I could also actually be swayed by Weezer. Pinkerton (while I personally dislike it) is an important moment. However, much like the argument above about Green Day - did Weezer really bring anything to the table? Not really, again Joy Division stands out in my mind as the genesis with bands like The Cure and Siousxie and the Banshees bringing the whole "emo" thing to the table and a head long before Rivers got sad.
 
Lee Newman said:
I don't really think it did. I really think it was the final death knoll in actual punk music, opening the doors to pop punk to take over. Even so, I don't think they changed music (good or bad) for the long term. Anything Green Day did is not more important or lasting then say The Clash, The Ramones, Sex Pistols or even Joy Division. Dookie being an "important" album to the 90's (again I'd debate this - I don't think it added anything to the conversation) does not equate to Green Day being important to music.
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Lee Newman said:
I could also actually be swayed by Weezer. Pinkerton (while I personally dislike it) is an important moment. However, much like the argument above about Green Day - did Weezer really bring anything to the table? Not really, again Joy Division stands out in my mind as the genesis with bands like The Cure and Siousxie and the Banshees bringing the whole "emo" thing to the table and a head long before Rivers got sad.
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I think what Green Day did (or whomever signed them) was made pop punk popular. They sold millions of records, while their forefathers sold far fewer records, but paved the way for bands like Green Day and those who followed. Same with Weezer. It’s kind of like The Velvet Underground. They didn’t sell many records, but influenced bands like REM who also sold a shit ton of records and changed the face of music.

side note: I am not suggesting that Green Day is as good as REM, just that they both changed music
 
Sonicpharmacist said:
I think what Green Day did (or whomever signed them) was made pop punk popular. They sold millions of records, while their forefathers sold far fewer records, but paved the way for bands like Green Day and those who followed. Same with Weezer. It’s kind of like The Velvet Underground. They didn’t sell many records, but influenced bands like REM who also sold a shit ton of records and changed the face of music.

side note: I am not suggesting that Green Day is as good as REM, just that they both changed music
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Again, I think Nirvana has more to do with what happened with Green Day than Green Day does. REM is a very interesting band to bring into the conversation. I think they did more than just continue Lou Reed and John Cale's musical legacy. They really made the whole indie band thing blow up which lead to the whole alternative scene, etc.... paving the way for Nirvana to pave the way for Green Day. I really think it has to be something more than just popular to really call someone important. Blink 182 sold a shit ton of records too and we can't seriously consider them as important.
 
Lee Newman said:
Again, I think Nirvana has more to do with what happened with Green Day than Green Day does. REM is a very interesting band to bring into the conversation. I think they did more than just continue Lou Reed and John Cale's musical legacy. They really made the whole indie band thing blow up which lead to the whole alternative scene, etc.... paving the way for Nirvana to pave the way for Green Day. I really think it has to be something more than just popular to really call someone important. Blink 182 sold a shit ton of records too and we can't seriously consider them as important.
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With blink, they wouldn’t have been popular without Green Day’s prior popularity. They just rode the wagon that was already in motion. Interesting conversation btw…
 
Sonicpharmacist said:
With blink, they wouldn’t have been popular without Green Day’s prior popularity. They just rode the wagon that was already in motion. Interesting conversation btw…
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I started a bigger thread in the general forum because I think it is a topic that is a lot of fun and Meaty Pizza is gonna remove a lot of voices from the conversation around here...

totally agree on Blink, which is why I think Green Day isn't really that important either... would they have broke big without Nirvana? Would Nirvana have been a big deal without Sonic Youth (and REM)? I do think Nirvana brings something to the table with the Beatlesque pop sensibility added to the punk aesthetic. Nirvana evolved so quickly that its hard to remember that they were basically just a punk band.
 
Joe Mac said:
Leave his poor long suffering Mam out of it. She’s too busy doing all his laundry making Turkey Twizzlers for his tea. And what thanks does she get? None, none at all!
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These were the food equivalent of Sunny D as a kid. Everyone knew they were god awful but kids wanted them anyway.

They “relaunched” them a couple of years ago without all the now-banned chemicals. i tried one and it tasted like ass. Or maybe they always tasted like ass and I just blanked it from my mind.
 
I DONT LIKE REGULAR TWIZZLERS. WHY THE FUCK WOULD I EAT A TURKEY ONE. WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU PEOPLE?!?!!

I HAVE NEVER EVER WANTED A GLASS OF SUNNY D. IT TASTE LIKE ORANGE JUICE THAT WENT BAD YEARS BEFORE SOMEONE PISSED IN IT AND PUT IT IN THE GLASS.
 
Lee Newman said:
Again, I think Nirvana has more to do with what happened with Green Day than Green Day does. REM is a very interesting band to bring into the conversation. I think they did more than just continue Lou Reed and John Cale's musical legacy. They really made the whole indie band thing blow up which lead to the whole alternative scene, etc.... paving the way for Nirvana to pave the way for Green Day. I really think it has to be something more than just popular to really call someone important. Blink 182 sold a shit ton of records too and we can't seriously consider them as important.
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I find the conversation with Green Day to be interesting because my friend group has this debate all the time about them specifically. Growing up in South Jersey I saw countless high school pop punk bands who were all inspired by Green Day; who dreamed of being a pop punk band because of Green Day and wanted to be the next Green Day. Im not going to say that sales =importance but there is definitely something to say about how they opened the door and introduced so many to the sound and the genre.
 
Fleetwood-Matt said:
I find the conversation with Green Day to be interesting because my friend group has this debate all the time about them specifically. Growing up in South Jersey I saw countless high school pop punk bands who were all inspired by Green Day; who dreamed of being a pop punk band because of Green Day and wanted to be the next Green Day. Im not going to say that sales =importance but there is definitely something to say about how they opened the door and introduced so many to the sound and the genre.
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That’s probably the piece I’m missing here. I think Screaming Trees was probably the last band that made me daydream of being in a band. I hadn’t thought about that aspect because I missed out on it. I was transitioning to work life and leaving carefree adolescence behind. I always saw Green Day as a child of Nirvana. I never really thought about the fact that those five years could make that big of a difference in the scope of a band.
 
Lee Newman said:
I DONT LIKE REGULAR TWIZZLERS. WHY THE FUCK WOULD I EAT A TURKEY ONE. WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU PEOPLE?!?!!

I HAVE NEVER EVER WANTED A GLASS OF SUNNY D. IT TASTE LIKE ORANGE JUICE THAT WENT BAD YEARS BEFORE SOMEONE PISSED IN IT AND PUT IT IN THE GLASS.
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…WHERE’S MY WERTHER’S ORIGINAL AND PRUNE JUICE!?!!
 
All this talk has me wondering what the discourse on Hole and specifically Live Through This would be if Courtney Love was married to some random bloke? I'm sure it played a huge factor, but just how much?

This is the true Marvel "What If...".
 
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