Political Discussion

OMC said:
When the orange asshole was pres, reading the morning news for what outrageous thing he had done in the previous 24 hours was always angst filled. Joe has been a breeze during his time as leader of the free world.
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it genuinely made me miss George Bush the lesser -- a man whom I hated when in office and thought very poorly of, but goddamn, however bad a presideent I thought he was (and I thought he was the worst ever at the time,) at no point did I seriously consider "well, GHB might be a wholly bought and owned and compromised foreign agent, or just incredibly presonally corrupt and crass and craven enough to ruin the country for his own personal gain"
 
OMC said:
When the orange asshole was pres, reading the morning news for what outrageous thing he had done in the previous 24 hours was always angst filled. Joe has been a breeze during his time as leader of the free world.
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I don't mean this as an attack, but that's a very privileged position for many of us to have. Sure Trump's rhetoric was a daily dose of anxiety, but under Biden abortion rights disappeared, right wing dismantling of education is everywhere, LGBTQ rights are not only rolling back but they're being criminalized, major war in Europe, major war in Middle East, worse income inequality than before, environmental protections being dismantled and zero substantive action on climate change, mainstreaming anti-immigration and mass deportation policies in the Democratic party while abandoning the promises made to DREAMERs, not dealing with the student loan crisis, defunding the humanities, alienated Muslim Americans. And sure that all probably would have been even worse under Trump, but for a lot of people it's not better and their daily anxiety with Biden is just as bad.
 
Hemotep said:
I don't mean this as an attack, but that's a very privileged position for many of us to have. Sure Trump's rhetoric was a daily dose of anxiety, but under Biden abortion rights disappeared, right wing dismantling of education is everywhere, LGBTQ rights are not only rolling back but they're being criminalized, major war in Europe, major war in Middle East, worse income inequality than before, environmental protections being dismantled and zero substantive action on climate change, mainstreaming anti-immigration and mass deportation policies in the Democratic party while abandoning the promises made to DREAMERs, not dealing with the student loan crisis, defunding the humanities, alienated Muslim Americans. And sure that all probably would have been even worse under Trump, but for a lot of people it's not better and their daily anxiety with Biden is just as bad.
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The roe v wade thing very much not a biden issue, but lays pretty directly at trump's feet, due to the supreme court fuckery and state's rights fuckery. I would make an (I think) strong argument that the other issues you mentioned are also outside the realm of presidential control (speaking as a floridian who cares about lgbt people in my life, and with school-age children)
 
yukbon said:
a few months ago we had a... “Discussion” where that she insisted she’d given my debit card back to me, in my hand, she definitely didn’t have it and if I had lost it, it was my own fault.

Three days later she tried to hand it to me. “What’s this?” I say. “Your debit card!” “The one you definitely don’t have and have back to me and it was my own fault for losing and it wasn’t your fault that I was careless?” She’s still mad that I quoted her back to her verbatim
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Comon guys, you are triggering flashbacks. I like my peaceful single life.
 
yukbon said:
The roe v wade thing very much not a biden issue, but lays pretty directly at trump's feet, due to the supreme court fuckery and state's rights fuckery. I would make an (I think) strong argument that the other issues you mentioned are also outside the realm of presidential control (speaking as a floridian who cares about lgbt people in my life, and with school-age children)
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Obama ran on codifying Roe, and changed his mind as soon as he was elected, despite having the biggest supermajority in both houses in recent years. Clinton had the chance too, and didn't. Biden has yet to take any extreme measures to alleviate people's suffering since it's ending. There's a lot more people to blame than just Trump for the death of Roe and it's aftershocks.
 
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Our future looks bright
 
yukbon said:
The roe v wade thing very much not a biden issue, but lays pretty directly at trump's feet, due to the supreme court fuckery and state's rights fuckery. I would make an (I think) strong argument that the other issues you mentioned are also outside the realm of presidential control (speaking as a floridian who cares about lgbt people in my life, and with school-age children)
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Just because he didn't cause it doesn't mean it's not a Biden issue. There is historical precident for the president to ignore the supreme court, expand it, etc. Especially after the McConnell and Trump fuckery. He did nothing, that's on him.
 
Hemotep said:
I don't mean this as an attack, but that's a very privileged position for many of us to have. Sure Trump's rhetoric was a daily dose of anxiety, but under Biden abortion rights disappeared, right wing dismantling of education is everywhere, LGBTQ rights are not only rolling back but they're being criminalized, major war in Europe, major war in Middle East, worse income inequality than before, environmental protections being dismantled and zero substantive action on climate change, mainstreaming anti-immigration and mass deportation policies in the Democratic party while abandoning the promises made to DREAMERs, not dealing with the student loan crisis, defunding the humanities, alienated Muslim Americans. And sure that all probably would have been even worse under Trump, but for a lot of people it's not better and their daily anxiety with Biden is just as bad.
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Rightly or wrongly I don’t think Biden had much to do with most of the crummy stuff listed here. I have found that the POTUS ability to make things better for your everyday person. I do think that a president does have the ability to make things much worse. Change for good happens slowly and incrementally in this country but change for ill can happen with the sign of a pen.

Bernie coulda been POTUS and of this BS would have still sadly gone down much in the same way. The executive is more useful as a check on the Judicial and legislative branch than it is on making substantive change. Congress being the most disfunctional body in the government is mostly to blame for the vast majority of these issue followed closely by having a SCOTUS stacked with grifters and prep school Catholics.
 
TenderLovingKiller® said:
Rightly or wrongly I don’t think Biden had much to do with most of the crummy stuff listed here. I have found that the POTUS ability to make things better for your everyday person. I do think that a president does have the ability to make things much worse. Change for good happens slowly and incrementally in this country but change for ill can happen with the sign of a pen.

Bernie coulda been POTUS and of this BS would have still sadly gone down much in the same way. The executive is more useful as a check on the Judicial and legislative branch than it is on making substantive change. Congress being the most disfunctional body in the government is mostly to blame for the vast majority of these issue followed closely by having a SCOTUS stacked with grifters and prep school Catholics.
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My comment above covers some of this, so sorry for the repeat. But it's not that Biden "did" all of these, most happened while he was president because of other things already in motion. But he very much did not fight publicly or try nearly anything to stop most of them. He fails as a check on the Judicial and Legislative branch. Post-Trump you (Biden, not you) can not put your head in the sand and pretend that business as usual is going to work. It won't, it hasn't, and he's refused to strengthen the institutions to prevent it from getting worse. He's enabled the slide into the quagmire we find ourselves in.
 
Hemotep said:
Just because he didn't cause it doesn't mean it's not a Biden issue. There is historical precident for the president to ignore the supreme court, expand it, etc. Especially after the McConnell and Trump fuckery. He did nothing, that's on him.
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Let’s say Roosevelt comes back from the dead and is magically. elected POTUS and the first thing he does is nominates 3 liberal justices to add to the SCOTUS do you think Manchin and Senima and Tester and like 10 other Senate institutionalist would vote to confirm? The reason a lot of the liberal agenda stalls out isn’t because of Biden. He isn’t the road block. If he pushed harder sadly he would just lose more often.
 
Hemotep said:
I don't mean this as an attack, but that's a very privileged position for many of us to have. Sure Trump's rhetoric was a daily dose of anxiety, but under Biden abortion rights disappeared, right wing dismantling of education is everywhere, LGBTQ rights are not only rolling back but they're being criminalized, major war in Europe, major war in Middle East, worse income inequality than before, environmental protections being dismantled and zero substantive action on climate change, mainstreaming anti-immigration and mass deportation policies in the Democratic party while abandoning the promises made to DREAMERs, not dealing with the student loan crisis, defunding the humanities, alienated Muslim Americans. And sure that all probably would have been even worse under Trump, but for a lot of people it's not better and their daily anxiety with Biden is just as bad.
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All of this is just a continuation of Trump though. It would have been so much worse if Trump stayed in office or worse had been successful in his insurrection
 
TenderLovingKiller® said:
Let’s say Roosevelt comes back from the dead and is magically. elected POTUS and the first thing he does is nominates 3 liberal justices to add to the SCOTUS do you think Manchin and Senima and Tester and like 10 other Senate institutionalist would vote to confirm? The reason a lot of the liberal agenda stalls out isn’t because of Biden. He isn’t the road block. If he pushed harder sadly he would just lose more often.
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Then he's not a very good negotiator
 
Hemotep said:
My comment above covers some of this, so sorry for the repeat. But it's not that Biden "did" all of these, most happened while he was president because of other things already in motion. But he very much did not fight publicly or try nearly anything to stop most of them. He fails as a check on the Judicial and Legislative branch. Post-Trump you (Biden, not you) can not put your head in the sand and pretend that business as usual is going to work. It won't, it hasn't, and he's refused to strengthen the institutions to prevent it from getting worse. He's enabled the slide into the quagmire we find ourselves in.
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Yeah this issue is that the checks and balances thing works both ways; the difference is one party is “handicapped” by actually working within the institutions for change while the other is all for straight dictatorship as long as they get their way. Anything that Biden would do to strengthen the executive branch now would only be taken advantage of the next time that a GOP demagogue was elected president.
 
Hemotep said:
Then he's not a very good negotiator
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Who would be? That person doesn’t exist. Literally, nothing happened and Siennema left the party. If he pushed hard enough Manchin would have been right behind her. The most charismatic and intelligent presidents within my lifetime were Clinton and Obama neither were able to radically shift things. It’s just not how this Country works sadly. I am all for fixing or correcting these issue in hopes of having a more representative liberal democracy but any shortcuts taken today is going to only hasten the fall into shit the next time a sociopath is elected president.
 
TenderLovingKiller® said:
Yeah this issue is that the checks and balances thing works both ways; the difference is one party is “handicapped” by actually working within the institutions for change while the other is all for straight dictatorship as long as they get their way. Anything that Biden would do to strengthen the executive branch now would only be taken advantage of the next time that a GOP demagogue was elected president.
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So we just wait until they do it themselves and get nothing out of it?
 
The best scenario is Biden wins reelection. The Right gives up on MAGA, Trump dies, and Clarence Thomas and/or Aleto kick the bucket. Then you have another 4 years of demographic shift along with some people under retirement age run for President and the Senate. Maybe things can start moving in a progressive direction.
 
TenderLovingKiller® said:
The best scenario is Biden wins reelection. The Right gives up on MAGA, Trump dies, and Clarence Thomas and/or Aleto kick the bucket. Then you have another 4 years of demographic shift along with some people under retirement age run for President and the Senate. Maybe things can start moving in a progressive direction.
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That's some pretty far-out magical thinking!
 
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