Splunders
Well-Known Member
You have the Black LVB in your posession? Can you return it once opened? If so, just listen to it on the Ultradeck as long as you can. Forget about the math - Just let yourself decide based on how it sounds to you.
MoFi UltraDeck / StudioDeck Owners and those interested
- Thread starter AnthonyI
- Start date
Zafu
New Member
I do, but haven't opened it yet. It's a bit more complicated than that. I don't want to set this up myself, so I'm paying a great Tech to set it up for me. I don't want to pay him twice. On every single tech site and tool, it indicates the mass of this, and its compliance is just a bad fit with the high mass Tone Arm of the UD. I don't want problems. I want joy. Again, it just feels like it's a mismatch and I'm trying too hard to convince myself it will be ok. It's too much money to gamble like that and maybe it will take months before I realize it. It's a comfort zone issue I guess.
Splunders
Well-Known Member
Ah, I didn't realize there was that added cost for you to mount it - that does make a difference.
I have the Ultradeck as well. Mine came with the Ultratracker cart, but I also already had a Grado Gold3 on hand, and flip flopped between the two a couple times and always landed on the Grado. To my ears, the Ultratracker was technically proficient but lacking life. The grado was sort of the opposite, and I preferred that.
Obviously, the Ultratracker is not the MasterTracker, so I can't speak on that. I eventually landed on a SoundSmith Zephyr MIMC ES for a really great deal, and have never wanted for more. That doesnt fit your MM needs, of course, just sharing my Ultradeck cartridge journey.
Zafu
New Member
I'm not sure that Zephyr would work with my MM input, but even if it would, it's close to $2,000. For less than half that I'm now looking at the
Nagaoka MP-500 (MP500) phono cartridge
Nagaoka MP-500 (MP500) phono cartridge
It's just below what I was going to spend on the LVB and seems like a lot better Cart than the Master Tracker or Sumiko Amethyst.
The compliance of the LVB is 22 µm/mN which was my problem. The compliance of the Nagaoka 500 is Dynamic compliance: 8.5 x 10-6 cm/dyne
I don't know how to convert how the Nagaoka expresses it to how LVB expresses theirs but suspect it's far more compatible to the Ultradeck. According to info I found. it appears the compliance in terms of how LVB expresses it is 17, a lot better than 22 for the mass of the UD tone arm.
Thoughts?
Last edited:
Static Shock
Member
When I first set up my account , I did not list my equipment . I have been searching the site including help , but have not found any info on how to list my equipment like some others have .
Any suggestions ?
Any suggestions ?
Click on your name/profile at top of page and go to "signature". You can fill it in there.
Static Shock
Member
Thank you , when I open signature a box pops up and I assume I just fill in the details and it will show up like yours has .
Unless they've changed something yep that should do it
folsom_lives
Well-Known Member
One caveat is that if your are browsing on your mobile phone you’ll have to turn it to landscape to see it or anyone else’s.
17 to 22 isn’t really that much- 4.4% difference. Also you can get the Nagaoka direct from Japan for around $600.
Nagaoka Phono Cartridge MP-500 Audio Accessory Collectible
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www.cdjapan.co.jp
Static Shock
Member
It worked thank you .
Zafu
New Member
17 to 22 isn’t really that much- 4.4% difference. Also you can get the Nagaoka direct from Japan for around $600.
Nagaoka Phono Cartridge MP-500 Audio Accessory Collectible
Audio Accessory,Nagaoka Phono Cartridge,Collectible listed at CDJapan! Get it delivered safely by SAL, EMS, FedEx and save with CDJapan Rewards!
Too many people I talk to are telling me I'm over-thinking this. I called a distributor for MoFi today and they told they've put Ortofon 2M's on UD's and so long as they are setup properly, work fine. On paper, there should be a problem with the mass of the UD Tone Arm and the LVB compliance of 22, however I'm letting go, surrendering, and since the LVB is sitting next to me, I'm gonna have my very capable and smart Tech take care of the rest. Hopefully, it all works out with the Cart I wanted in the first place before I started going down the technical rabbit hole. Gonna let him have it for the weekend so he can take his time, recheck, adjust, etc. I'll circle back here probably on Tuesday next week to report back. Thanks to all of you for your help and patience.
kvetcha
Well-Known Member
Report back!
HayesWeighsIn
Well-Known Member
For sure!! That LVB is supposed to be a heck of a cart, @Zafu
Static Shock
Member
We all have been down that rabbit hole . In the end let the music guide you .
Good luck .
Zafu
New Member
Is the Tone Arm weight on the Studio Deck and Ultra Deck the same?
I found very interesting information that, if true, and have no reason to doubt it, suggests the decks may be able to take MM Carts I've been previously led to believe would be off the charts in Hz given their compliance ratings. I'm wondering if the damping for the Arm isn't allowing for higher compliance than previously thought. ?
This is the info. I found.
" Per MoFi"
The UltraDeck Tonearm Effective Mass is 25.14g. We have mounted many cartridges from Ortofon, Grado, Hana, Audio Technica, Denon, and others that work great with both of our turntables. You want to avoid any cartridges that are specified as high compliance but the majority of today’s cartridges are either medium or low compliance and will work great with your turntable.
The compliance of our cartridges at 100Hz is available;
Studio Tracker
Static compliance : 35 x 10e-6/dyne
Dynamic compliance : 8 x 10e-6/dyne
Ultra Tracker
Static compliance : 35 x 10e-6/dyne
Dynamic compliance : 10 x 10e-6/dyne
Master Tracker
Static compliance : 40 x 10e-6/dyne
Dynamic compliance : 10 x 10e-6/dyne
I found very interesting information that, if true, and have no reason to doubt it, suggests the decks may be able to take MM Carts I've been previously led to believe would be off the charts in Hz given their compliance ratings. I'm wondering if the damping for the Arm isn't allowing for higher compliance than previously thought. ?
This is the info. I found.
" Per MoFi"
The UltraDeck Tonearm Effective Mass is 25.14g. We have mounted many cartridges from Ortofon, Grado, Hana, Audio Technica, Denon, and others that work great with both of our turntables. You want to avoid any cartridges that are specified as high compliance but the majority of today’s cartridges are either medium or low compliance and will work great with your turntable.
The compliance of our cartridges at 100Hz is available;
Studio Tracker
Static compliance : 35 x 10e-6/dyne
Dynamic compliance : 8 x 10e-6/dyne
Ultra Tracker
Static compliance : 35 x 10e-6/dyne
Dynamic compliance : 10 x 10e-6/dyne
Master Tracker
Static compliance : 40 x 10e-6/dyne
Dynamic compliance : 10 x 10e-6/dyne
Why not? I think the arm dampening by reducing the resonances actually increases the compatibility with different carts. The LVB cart you're considering is still technically a medium compliance cart (though at 22 um it's pushing it). Nagaokas have much lower compliance than Ortofon on par or even lower than MoFi, but that's not everything. I'd still get a MasterTracker instead of Nagaoka MP-500 for my money because it was designed for Ultradeck. But it's an easier choice for me because I have a used UltraTracker body I can trade in to get a discount
I believe the weights between the two is the same (I had an SD before upgrading to UD).
AnthonyI
Well-Known Member
You know, when the MoFi decks came out this compliance thing made people heads explode for some reason. All I kept hearing was "It can't work due to compliance" "There's no way the tone arm mass is 25g", and on and on and on.
Here's the thing, if your not going crazy exotic on your cart selection, these decks handle them quite well.
Point of reference, I've run the following on my UD without issue:
Audio Techinca VM95ML
Denon DL-103R
Goldring E3
Goldring G1042
Grado Black
Grado Gold
Grado Opus3
Hana SL
MoFi Mastertracker
MoFi UltraTracker
Ortofon 2M Blue
Ortofon Quintet Blue
Ortofon Quintet Bronze
Zafu
New Member
Why not? I think the arm dampening by reducing the resonances actually increases the compatibility with different carts. The LVB cart you're considering is still technically a medium compliance cart (though at 22 um it's pushing it). Nagaokas have much lower compliance than Ortofon on par or even lower than MoFi, but that's not everything. I'd still get a MasterTracker instead of Nagaoka MP-500 for my money because it was designed for Ultradeck. But it's an easier choice for me because I have a used UltraTracker body I can trade in to get a discount
I believe the weights between the two is the same (I had an SD before upgrading to UD).
Yes, we are saying the same thing about the dampening and you are validating my suspicion that the dampening allows for more MM Cart choices than what the mass of the tone arm and compliance would suggest.
This may seem silly, but because the Master Tracker is $500 when purchased with Ultradeck and $800 if not, and I'm facing paying $800, given the reviews of the LVB and the MP-500 for that matter, I just though they would be superior in every way. My fear is all around resonance and finding distortion, particularly in low frequencies and tracking issues potentially.
My preamp only accepts MM, so for the moment, that's my limitation, otherwise this would be less problematic as there are far more MC compliant Carts for the UD.
Static Shock
Member
Quite a list . I am a year or more from having to replace my MasterTracker but I would be interested in hearing how , in your opinion , these cart. compared to the MasterTracker . Yes I know its subjective and influenced by room and equipment ----but your list and experience is extensive .