Political Discussion

Lee Newman said:
The campaign releasing this actually makes me reconsider whether I want to support Bernie at all. It’s a smarmy move and not helpful right now.
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All campaigns do it. Bernie released his own app to keep track of results since they had caucus heads in each district. I’m not saying they’re official, but if the two totals don’t add up within a reasonable margin of error someone is wrong.

I think this whole debauchery is going to make Iowa pretty meaningless regardless who wins and how close it was. The real campaigns will begin in NH since they don’t do a caucus.
 
Lee Newman said:
The campaign releasing this actually makes me reconsider whether I want to support Bernie at all. It’s a smarmy move and not helpful right now.
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I don't really see an issue with it. Buttigieg's campaign did the same thing, and he declared victory (which he's now backtracked on apparently?) with 0% of the vote officially reported. I'm sure Warren or Biden's campaign would've done the exact same thing if their internal results showed them ahead. All of the campaigns will do whatever they can to win. Publicly declaring yourself the winner without full results is worse imo.
 
wokeupnew said:
All campaigns do it. Bernie released his own app to keep track of results since they had caucus heads in each district. I’m not saying they’re official, but if the two totals don’t add up within a reasonable margin of error someone is wrong.

I think this whole debauchery is going to make Iowa pretty meaningless regardless who wins and how close it was. The real campaigns will begin in NH since they don’t do a caucus.
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Jorduck said:
I don't really see an issue with it. Buttigieg's campaign did the same thing, and he declared victory (which he's now backtracked on apparently?) with 0% of the vote officially reported. I'm sure Warren or Biden's campaign would've done the exact same thing if their internal results showed them ahead. All of the campaigns will do whatever they can to win. Publicly declaring yourself the winner without full results is worse imo.
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I don’t have a problem with the comparison thing. I have a problem with the releasing it amidst the complications.
 
Lee Newman said:
The campaign releasing this actually makes me reconsider whether I want to support Bernie at all. It’s a smarmy move and not helpful right now.
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He had to because Pete went and declared victory on national television which sent the momentum of the news cycle spinning.

AND Pete did the same thing WITHOUT including other candidate's numbers.
 
Lee Newman said:
I don’t have a problem with the comparison thing. I have a problem with the releasing it amidst the complications.
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Fair enough, I understand your view. I just don't think there was any way it was going to end up differently. The fiasco around the app/phone issues/etc is, obviously, about as far away from an ideal process as possible.
 
Jan said:
www.scientificamerican.com

Truly Secure Voting Is on the Way

Unfortunately, it won’t be here by 2020
www.scientificamerican.com www.scientificamerican.com
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That's interesting but I still don't trust that. How do you verify for yourself that a given machine is running the exact code it claims to be? How do you know the votes stored on that machine/server make it to the actual count? I realize elections will always be on some level trust-dependent but it's hard not to trust a piece of paper that you yourself have written on.
 
I'm actually quite surprised by the results reported so far. Only 71% of precincts have reported, but Buttigieg has the lead. And Biden is in 4th.

I would have thought it would have been close between Biden and Sanders. It's not.

I never expected Buttigieg to preform so well either.
 
so Iowa does not really have that many delegates, and they have historically been more important for the race boost they give those who do well there- affirmation, media attention, the ability to say, "see, I can win!"

with this fumble, I feel like it further knocks against the importance of the Iowa kickoff. the attention is on the debacle and not the Iowa boost- which I don't think is the worst thing. the makeup of the voter populace in Iowa increasingly does not match the face of the modern Democratic party- and while I know this is changing AND their voice is still very important, I think it skews perceptions more. same for NH, for that matter.
 
Anyone see the video that has gone viral of the women finding out that Buttigieg is gay?

She voted for him in the Iowa Caucus and had no idea that he was the only openly gay candidate. She was completely aghast with herself after learning this and having voted for him.

It became clear she was homophobic and this would have changed her vote had she known.


But what my take really is out of this is people really don't know that much about the candidates they vote for. And that's scary. People are not making voting decisions on their best interest.
 
bfly said:
so Iowa does not really have that many delegates, and they have historically been more important for the race boost they give those who do well there- affirmation, media attention, the ability to say, "see, I can win!"

with this fumble, I feel like it further knocks against the importance of the Iowa kickoff. the attention is on the debacle and not the Iowa boost- which I don't think is the worst thing. the makeup of the voter populace in Iowa increasingly does not match the face of the modern Democratic party- and while I know this is changing AND their voice is still very important, I think it skews perceptions more. same for NH, for that matter.
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it's VERY interesting that Bernie won the vast majority of districts that had a majority/strong minority, non-white makeup. 2016 Clinton is 2020 Bernie. And a lot of votes for Polk (DSM) county are still not counted where Bernie is expected to do well. He should win in NH because of proximity to VT, Buttigieg may have a little bit of a boost from some voters there, but it'll be interesting to see what happens in SC, NV and Super Tuesday where states start to get much more diverse. Buttigieg is doing terribly with non-white voters.
 
wokeupnew said:
it's VERY interesting that Bernie won the vast majority of districts that had a majority/strong minority, non-white makeup. 2016 Clinton is 2020 Bernie. And a lot of votes for Polk (DSM) county are still not counted where Bernie is expected to do well. He should win in NH because of proximity to VT, Buttigieg may have a little bit of a boost from some voters there, but it'll be interesting to see what happens in SC, NV and Super Tuesday where states start to get much more diverse. Buttigieg is doing terribly with non-white voters.
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Bernie did incredibly well in NH in 2016, and I would be shocked if it didn't play out the same now. Biden considers SC his "firewall," and I don't see Buttigieg taking the moderate reins from him there but I guess only time will tell. listened to a podcast earlier this week that talked with some Yang voters in the caucus, and many of them had caucused for Trump in 2016 and found Yang's financial message resonated with them most now.

I'm mailing in my absentee ballot for TX this week. I'm tired.
 
The end of the impeachment trial likely will not be today. Well, it will be and isn't.

Trump's expected acquittal is expected today. And republican senators say they hope that the Democrats will "accept the results".

Meanwhile, on the Democrats side, a subpoena for John Bolton is likely to be issues soon as they continue their investigation and new evidence comes out. There may be more articles of impeachment sent to the senate.
 
Bennnnn said:
The
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Phaneronic said:
That's interesting but I still don't trust that. How do you verify for yourself that a given machine is running the exact code it claims to be? How do you know the votes stored on that machine/server make it to the actual count? I realize elections will always be on some level trust-dependent but it's hard not to trust a piece of paper that you yourself have written on.
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I´m with you on that. We have a very old-school paper Ballot and pen Voting System in Germany., So there are actual Ballot boxes that can be recount in case there is something strange. But since i just read this article last week i wanted to give a quick Picture About what People are working on technically. But even that artile said Nothing of those new technical measures is ready for the 2020 election. In the given Voting Systems employed there is a great Risk of someone atacking the electiosn. It does´t even have to be Grand plan of fraud, if you want to hurt trust in american democrazy a few malicious agents that are able to hack certain precincts and make then report Nonsensical results would be enough
 
I was in Iowa orchestrating a precinct and canvassing for Bernie. I have spent the past 24+ hours defending the integrity if the process on social media, but shit is about to hit the fan.

This morning the elected official who ran the caucuses in Blackhawk County released his data onto Twitter out of frustration while lamenting that the data had been handed over almost immediately on the night of the election.

Then when the batch updated to 85% percent reported, there was a HUGE discrepancy in the data. Bernie was missing roughly 500 votes. The DNC issued a statement there was going to be an update to that batch...

Meanwhile, the satellite caucuses that went huge for Bernie have yet to report according to numerous precinct captains. Including the one my brother served as secretary for-- that went 8 delegates to 0 for Bernie.
 

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