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@Tyr

This is what I’d do:

Within set confines:
Klipsch La Scala AL5 $13,198
NAD M23 $3749
NAD M66 $5499
Primaluna Evo 100 $3695
VPI Scout 21 $3300
Grado Platinum 3 $400
=$29,841

Going all out… same to turntable and then:
VPI Dragon $8800
Grado Epoch3 $12000
= $46,941

I honestly think you would need a professional PA for the stage. No idea what any of that is.
 
Lee Newman said:
@Tyr

This is what I’d do:

Within set confines:
Klipsch La Scala AL5 $13,198
NAD M23 $3749
NAD M66 $5499
Primaluna Evo 100 $3695
VPI Scout 21 $3300
Grado Platinum 3 $400
=$29,841

Going all out… same to turntable and then:
VPI Dragon $8800
Grado Epoch3 $12000
= $46,941

I honestly think you would need a professional PA for the stage. No idea what any of that is.
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Also not for nothing if it were me, I’d look at multiple sets of speakers for various reasons. Something like KEF ls150 metas set up in corners and something with a different profile from both the Klipsch and the KEFs. You’d probably then need multiple amps and an amp selector. At that point I might make very different choices for different set ups. But then the budget ain’t even in the right hemisphere.
 
Joe Mac said:
As much as I love my tubes I’m not sure of tubes in a commercial setting, driving them that hard that often is going to cost a small fortune in tube replacements. Whatever you have does need to speak to drama though and things like physically big name speakers (something like the nautilus or blades could also do that in a more modern setting) and maybe physically large amps with things like VU meters or an odd design are definitely good ideas. You probably are going to end up doubling or trippling that budget!
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All part of the many reasons I don't think this is really a viable business if I'm honest.

Tyr said:
combination of the intimate listening bars in Tokyo meets Spiritland in the UK
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Tyr said:
using the hifi part of the business as a loss leader to be propped up by the bar/food service
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So two things here:
Spiritland - this is just a bar/restaurant that is using vinyl and hifi as the gimmick. I think this concept totally works, and I think just having vinyl spinning live is enough. I've seen loads of bars and record shops successfully run "listening parties" without any hifi investment. This is why I think a PA is the right solution for the budget and the concept. Remember even a mediocre PA system is still far more exciting and immersive than most stereo systems the average person under 40-45 has ever heard.

Toyko - that's entirely different market. Entirely different culture. There are countless reasons that format works there vs here. Truly apples to oranges.

Joe Mac said:
One thing that used to happen here, and was successful before the pandemic, was that a couple used to rent a room in a nice pub in town and went into partnership with a high end hifi store in town. They used to get the lend of an over €100k system, would source a really good pressing of a classic album and would arrange nice wine and nibbles and talkers around the album. I think they used to charge €20 a ticket and regularly sold it out.
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This concept could absolutely work... if you have the hifi retail partner. However this doesn't resolve the day to day, which I think a PA system still solves for. But yes, listening parties and cover charges totally make sense.
 
I mean tube worries is the beauty of having something like the M66 which has a capable phono. You could then reserve the Evo for those special listening events. (Although then we get into if it’s really special … you have a different table and the guys may be right for practical reasons, a technics may be a better call). I think you need a system that is capable and also pretty in a scenario like this and I think if you fail to include tubes you are gonna loose some Looky loos.

A partnership with a hifi store and a record store would be a great thing in this kind of scenario as both could use the venue as advertising and make sure you are fresh with gear/source for a steep discount/cost (assuming it is financially beneficial to both groups)
 
Lee Newman said:
I mean tube worries is the beauty of having something like the M66 which has a capable phono. You could then reserve the Evo for those special listening events. (Although then we get into if it’s really special … you have a different table and the guys may be right for practical reasons, a technics may be a better call). I think you need a system that is capable and also pretty in a scenario like this and I think if you fail to include tubes you are gonna loose some Looky loos.

A partnership with a hifi store and a record store would be a great thing in this kind of scenario as both could use the venue as advertising and make sure you are fresh with gear/source for a steep discount/cost (assuming it is financially beneficial to both groups)
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I don’t know if the NADs are enough of an event? They’re nice looking in a sorta modern no nonsense way but they’re not gorgeous, like say a Luxman or tubes, or interesting/different, like say Pathos. The thing that probably needs to be the least beautiful, and can be the most functional, is the TT because it can be boxed and may require being hidden.

Cartridge would involve considerations too becuase while it might not need to track like it would in a nightclub setting for a DJ its definitely going to need to track better than in most domestic applications. Probably rules Grado out.
 
Joe Mac said:
I don’t know if the NADs are enough of an event? They’re nice looking in a sorta modern no nonsense way but they’re not gorgeous, like say a Luxman or tubes, or interesting/different, like say Pathos. The thing that probably needs to be the least beautiful, and can be the most functional, is the TT because it can be boxed and may require being hidden.

Cartridge would involve considerations too becuase while it might not need to track like it would in a nightclub setting for a DJ its definitely going to need to track better than in most domestic applications. Probably rules Grado out.
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Could always go hifi rose for streaming, they are definitely eye catching. Again, the budget seems smallish for the implementation. The more I think about it, the more partnering with a hifi store or a equipment manufacturer would be necessary to really pull it off.

I would think a lot of cost outside of the actual system would be to build an audio version of the nick knacks you see at like a chilis. Those Japanese bars always have those busy walls and there is no way they are playing stuff out of everything there. You could buy some fun looking douk stuff and hit some thrift stores to put eye candy stuff up that doesn’t actually serve a purpose to the sound of the room.

As far as tracking, @Tyr add isolation to that other capital line…. 😝
 
Lee Newman said:
As far as tracking, @Tyr add isolation to that other capital line…. 😝
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Isolation for sure. Given the volume and the footfall and bumps that happen in a bar situation I’d still be looking for a better tracker. You wouldn’t need to go full DJ but Grado are amongst the poorest tracking cartridges I’ve had, with the pay off obviously being how they sound.
 
@Tyr - for added inspiration, here’s an article on the best vinyl bars in Melbourne.

I can’t really help you on specs, but my tuppence worth is that I would think the speakers would be the key thing here, and that they would have to still sound good right up against a wall or encased in shelving our up at a higher height than floor height. They have to fit into the ergonomics of the space and still sound good.

Best of luck with this, I’m sure you’ll smash it!

Best Listening Bars in Melbourne

The audiophile bar started in Japan, but it’s well and truly arrived here. Check out these spots to hear talented DJs working high-end sound systems you probably can’t afford at home.
www.broadsheet.com.au www.broadsheet.com.au
 
Bsdmr2 said:
I am! With a Linn front end.

If I were you I’d go for the Linn if you just want one box to do all. The DACs can be upgraded and it’s modular. I’ve not heard it however!

But, if you aren’t intent on an all in one, then Naim offers better options I think for gradual multi box evolution.

In terms of sound, they will sound different. Linn is meant to be more analytical and detailed, Naim more energetic.

It also depends on what speakers you are powering and if one drives them better than the other.
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Exactly what I needed! I think I’m going to save for the Linn. I think I’m just frustrated that it’s taking longer to get there than I would like, and was looking for alternatives.
 
Tyr said:
These are all very valuable points. Some of them I’ve considered and others I haven’t. So thank you!

I was thinking more of a combination of the intimate listening bars in Tokyo meets Spiritland in the UK. So a space that is one thing for some people and a different thing for others. I was thinking of having specific days/times for active listening sessions, bring your own record, and guest DJ spots etc. And using the hifi part of the business as a loss leader to be propped up by the bar/food service. I own a % of two coffee shops in AZ so I’ve used that business experience to kind of inform how I’d need to set up one side of the business to support the passion side. Plus, I don’t plan on taking on any investors or incurring business debt so the entire venture (live or die) will be based on the runway I give it plus the lessons I’ve learned with other startups. It’s basically my passion/retirement project. I’m using my corporate salary to support personal $ needs for the first 3-4 years of the biz to ensure it’s lucrative enough for me to actually leave the corporate world.

Your points about the visual is an exquisite one. That’s what caught me the first time I walked into one of the Japanese listening bars. I may have to add more $ to the budget. LOL
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here's a hi-fi bar that opened up in NYC recently. I haven't been yet but love the shop/label that runs it:

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might give you some inspiration. i believe their early posts might have some info about their speakers and such as well? also can give you an idea of the types of events they throw. they do lots of advanced listening parties for certain albums, do some cool label features for listening parties ,etc.

edit: this is the company they used for some custom speakers:
www.one-a-way.com

Project

www.one-a-way.com www.one-a-way.com
 
Also with a tonearm that long, I feel like you should be required to have some ridiculously large cart to complete the cartoon effect.
 
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