Vinyl as an investment video...

NoTrend

NoTrend

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Really interested in what the people here think of the above video (not interested in creating any drama, the people here seem pretty level headed, and seem to be able to have a healthy discussion). This was in my youtube feed this AM, I am not a big "VC" person, and I think most of these content creators are not for me.

All I will say is I completely disagree with pretty much everything Mike says in this video, for many, many reasons. I also think this is interesting coming from someone that has an interest in making as much money as possible on records, this is not an attack on Mike, but that fact is undeniable.
 
Vinyl is a trend that's likely at or very close to its peak. In my opinion trends are possibly the worst investments you can make and should never be relied upon for long term wealth management for obvious reasons, trends may last but the value generally doesn't. Sure some records will hold their value but most won't. It's a terrible idea, but he's free to hawk his wares because there's a sucker born every minute.

EDIT- I would also add it's a terrible investment because unlike investing in commodities with quantifiable value like Gold etc, it's impossible to actually sell a record collection for it's perceived value. You'll get pennies on the dollar, the only way to get anywhere close to perceived value is to individually sell every record to individuals looking to buy at or above median value, which would take years. That whole collection? You MIGHT get 40% of total value to bulk sell it. Honestly it's an idiotic idea to promote this. But record store owners generally aren't the most grounded individuals I've ever met, especially low level D grade you tube celebrity ones...
 
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NoTrend said:


Really interested in what the people here think of the above video (not interested in creating any drama, the people here seem pretty level headed, and seem to be able to have a healthy discussion). This was in my youtube feed this AM, I am not a big "VC" person, and I think most of these content creators are not for me.

All I will say is I completely disagree with pretty much everything Mike says in this video, for many, many reasons. I also think this is interesting coming from someone that has an interest in making as much money as possible on records, this is not an attack on Mike, but that fact is undeniable.
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This man is awful. He’s been awful for a very long time. He’s a legitimised scalper who believes his own hubris off the back of being a very minor YouTube celebrity in a very small and niche area.

It’s terrible advice. Really terrible advice. Compounded by the fact that he believes in it for totally selfish reasons to extract every last penny possible from people in a captive market.
 
What's interesting is (and please all, know I am not trying to be THAT guy, or gate keepery)

For decades, while sure some "collectors" knew punk was "collectable" it was no secret even for punks, stuff like those Misfits 7"s, first Necros 7", first Minor Threat 7" were all pretty pricey. I have a few rare punk/hardcore 7"s that I listen to, I do not care if they are worth 5 bucks, or 500...

But (and I could be wrong), I'm pretty sure mike does not care about American 80s hardcore. He totally admits something like "punk has been leading the way for collectable records"..proceeds to show off all these rare misfits singles. I am not at all saying you need to know everything from Flipper, to Void, to The Middle Class to collect/buy 80s hardcore singles...but come on those singles are clearly just investments to him, nothing more. He does not have much interest in the music, or why those records are important, or why they're even rare to begin with. It feels so disingenuous...
 
80s hardcore and early Sub Pop (pre-Nevermind) have always been collectible. You probably remember the wanted ads in the back of zines like MRR and Flipside? I was lucky to be working in a record store around that time and had readily available access to a lot of that stuff. I sold a lot of early Sub Pop singles, including #789 of the Love Buzz 45, to Europeans for quite a bit of money. Never bought them to flip them. But even then I never thought of it as an investment. If some crazy guy from Switzerland wants to give me a ton of $$ for a couple of Mudhoney songs that I can get on cd, that is fine by me.
 
jamieanderson1968 said:
80s hardcore and early Sub Pop (pre-Nevermind) have always been collectible. You probably remember the wanted ads in the back of zines like MRR and Flipside? I was lucky to be working in a record store around that time and had readily available access to a lot of that stuff. I sold a lot of early Sub Pop singles, including #789 of the Love Buzz 45, to Europeans for quite a bit of money. Never bought them to flip them. But even then I never thought of it as an investment. If some crazy guy from Switzerland wants to give me a ton of $$ for a couple of Mudhoney songs that I can get on cd, that is fine by me.
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yup, I mean Sub Pop ALWAYS angled it that way. Those early Touch and Go or Dischord singles, we all knew were "collectable" (barf), but that had more to do with because they thought 300-500 copies of a pressing were enough/that's all they could afford.

I'm pretty sure those early Dischord singles had the Crass-esq "Pay no more than..." on the back

Poison Idea were almost right... Record Collectors Are Investment Assholes

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NoTrend said:
What's interesting is (and please all, know I am not trying to be THAT guy, or gate keepery)

For decades, while sure some "collectors" knew punk was "collectable" it was no secret even for punks, stuff like those Misfits 7"s, first Necros 7", first Minor Threat 7" were all pretty pricey. I have a few rare punk/hardcore 7"s that I listen to, I do not care if they are worth 5 bucks, or 500...

But (and I could be wrong), I'm pretty sure mike does not care about American 80s hardcore. He totally admits something like "punk has been leading the way for collectable records"..proceeds to show off all these rare misfits singles. I am not at all saying you need to know everything from Flipper, to Void, to The Middle Class to collect/buy 80s hardcore singles...but come on those singles are clearly just investments to him, nothing more. He does not have much interest in the music, or why those records are important, or why they're even rare to begin with. It feels so disingenuous...
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People who see music as a collectible/investment baffle my mind.
 
Ugh…. What the fuck… watching this now.

I want to listen to music. My Beatles records get played all the time because they are my favorites. I didn’t buy them because I thought they would be worth a lot.

“Investment grade.” Grading completely removes the reason the item exists. Fucking capsule records. It’s stupid in magic and comic books, etc.
 
Mather said:
I'm not sure if I've ever had more enjoyment in this hobby than buying 40 year old sealed records and ripping those fuckers open and playing them immediately. Ziggy 82 Mofi being by far the most fun.
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Yeah. I love opening records. I also like throwing all the dumb stickers and shit on the shrink in the trash.
 
Lee Newman said:
Also, fuck Mike.
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I don't know much about the guy, but the bottom line is he owns a record store that caters to audiophiles and people who will spend a bit of money on OG presses etc. That all is fine, you do you. But what is also interesting is he posts this video, which I'm sure he knows will get people talking or make people angry (he completely admits it at the start of the video), he has a pretty big "Japanese Grails" auction just a few hours later...I'm sure he would say "I was planning this video anyway" but I don't buy it. Like every other content creator, especially someone like him in the "VC" (I'm sorry, I still think that term is so stupid) that has influence, this content was all a part of making sure he had more eyes on that auction. It just all seems really gross.
 
also he just posted a comment and pasted it on top of the video... about how he doesn't have any more than 20 sealed records...dude you showed about 2 blue trains that were sealed.... this guy is super disingenuous.

I don't even care about sealed records, I have sealed records I just haven't gotten to yet, but come on

edit: here is the comment

was sure this video would stir some discussion, and it did, but I needed to clarify a few things. My collection is not about sealed records; I have very few—maybe less than 20. For me, it's about the music and the experience of listening to these records, regardless of their value. 99.9% of records will never skyrocket in price; they may appreciate over time, but they will always be within reach. However, the super rare iconic records, in my view, are undervalued and could see a significant increase in value in the coming years. Part of the point of this video was pointing out that the very rarest and most desirable records sell for 100x times less than there counterparts in other collectible marketplaces and in my opinion that is going to change. Other than some exceptions, I don't see slabbing becoming huge immediately with non-sealed records, but who will open and play a sealed original Dark Side Of The Moon? Dropping the value from $2,000 to $100? That is the perfect candidate for slabbing. Also, the caliber of records I'm talking about seldom come in the shop, so It's not like I'm pushing these records up to line my pockets.
 
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NoTrend said:
also he just posted a comment and pasted it on top of the video... about how he doesn't have any more than 20 sealed records...dude you showed about 2 blue trains that were sealed.... this guy is super disingenuous.

I don't even care about sealed records, I have sealed records I just haven't gotten to yet, but come on

edit: here is the comment

was sure this video would stir some discussion, and it did, but I needed to clarify a few things. My collection is not about sealed records; I have very few—maybe less than 20. For me, it's about the music and the experience of listening to these records, regardless of their value. 99.9% of records will never skyrocket in price; they may appreciate over time, but they will always be within reach. However, the super rare iconic records, in my view, are undervalued and could see a significant increase in value in the coming years. Part of the point of this video was pointing out that the very rarest and most desirable records sell for 100x times less than there counterparts in other collectible marketplaces and in my opinion that is going to change. Other than some exceptions, I don't see slabbing becoming huge immediately with non-sealed records, but who will open and play a sealed original Dark Side Of The Moon? Dropping the value from $2,000 to $100? That is the perfect candidate for slabbing. Also, the caliber of records I'm talking about seldom come in the shop, so It's not like I'm pushing these records up to line my pockets.
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I’m not gonna watch the video but if he has 2 OG Blue Trains sealed, he’s definitely showing this video because Jazz Record Center just sold an OG copy of Blue Train for $12,000 on eBay and it wasn’t even sealed.
 
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