kvetcha
Well-Known Member
Looking forward to giving this a spin. Never listened to Swans!
The N&G Listening Club V1 - Archive only
- Thread starter Bohnjaggs
- Start date
Crenshaw Blvd
Well-Known Member
I liked The Collection. My favorite songs were Mama, No Maps of the past, Siddhartha and The Listener. Cool pick. I need to give it more listens so I've added it to my listening club playlist. I heard the coldplay similarity in parts of the vocals...and got a Sufjan Stevens vibe in other areas. What is the story of that band? Did they used to be a Christian band but aren't anymore?
Crenshaw Blvd
Well-Known Member
Swans is rad! I'm going to be listening to weird shit at very high volumes today. 
One of my regrets in life is seeing this used at my local and passing it up (because I already had too many other things). If I did buy it...it would instantly ascend to the top of records that'll drive my wife crazy list...but I love it!
One of my regrets in life is seeing this used at my local and passing it up (because I already had too many other things). If I did buy it...it would instantly ascend to the top of records that'll drive my wife crazy list...but I love it!
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ayayrawn
Well-Known Member
This album RULES.
fun fact: first professional I ever conducted was with Michael Gira. Intimidating to say the least.
BoilerRhapsody
Active Member
Listened to a fair bit of Swans, only album of theirs to ever properly gel with me was To Be Kind. It'll be cool to really did into this more than I have before though.
TrainFan73
Frothy
My officemate did not like Swans. Lol.
Dtknuckles
Well-Known Member
BoilerRhapsody
Active Member
Just finished my first listen though of the week.
I've only listened to old Swans recently, so this new era of Swans really does feel like the Post-Rock maximal/minimal tension/relaxation thing, like GY!BE but to an extreme. The thing I think I like much more about To Be Kind than The Seer is that the construction of it all feels much more considered. To Be Kind opens with Screen Shot, which immediately introduces this incredible tense level of energy that actually ends up with this unbelievable burst to resolve it nearly two hours later. The Seer with Lunacy is a similar set up, but I think it gets nowhere near in terms of satisfying that tension, it just kind of on and off pummels you until its a slog to get through the whole thing. No doubt an uninterrupted and dedicated full listen through would reveal a lot more 'narrative', but I just don't feel it at the moment, I hope I get an opportunity this weekend to do that though. I'm pretty sure my first listen through of To Be Kind (Was maybe my first time listening to a Swans album too?) had my full attention so I'm sure that helped.
I've only listened to old Swans recently, so this new era of Swans really does feel like the Post-Rock maximal/minimal tension/relaxation thing, like GY!BE but to an extreme. The thing I think I like much more about To Be Kind than The Seer is that the construction of it all feels much more considered. To Be Kind opens with Screen Shot, which immediately introduces this incredible tense level of energy that actually ends up with this unbelievable burst to resolve it nearly two hours later. The Seer with Lunacy is a similar set up, but I think it gets nowhere near in terms of satisfying that tension, it just kind of on and off pummels you until its a slog to get through the whole thing. No doubt an uninterrupted and dedicated full listen through would reveal a lot more 'narrative', but I just don't feel it at the moment, I hope I get an opportunity this weekend to do that though. I'm pretty sure my first listen through of To Be Kind (Was maybe my first time listening to a Swans album too?) had my full attention so I'm sure that helped.
Taevis
Active Member
I agree that To Be Kind feels more well-constructed and holds attention much easier than The Seer. But while I feel like the individual songs on To Be Kind are better, The Seer gives more of a complete album narrative if that makes sense.
TrainFan73
Frothy
So... and let me know if this is out of line, but how do we feel about this:
pitchfork.com
I know this is a listening club, but things like this change how we feel about and in turn how we listen to these acts or we separate which is a personal choice. Since this one isn’t as cut and dry as others, I think it’s an interesting talking point anyhow.
Swans' Michael Gira Issues Statement on Rape Accusations, Larkin Grimm Responds
Gira: "It was an awkward mistake." Grimm: "This is a perfect example of why we need to have education about consent."
I know this is a listening club, but things like this change how we feel about and in turn how we listen to these acts or we separate which is a personal choice. Since this one isn’t as cut and dry as others, I think it’s an interesting talking point anyhow.
blissfullychaotic
Well-Known Member
So... and let me know if this is out of line, but how do we feel about this:
Swans' Michael Gira Issues Statement on Rape Accusations, Larkin Grimm Responds
Gira: "It was an awkward mistake." Grimm: "This is a perfect example of why we need to have education about consent."
I know this is a listening club, but things like this change how we feel about and in turn how we listen to these acts or we separate which is a personal choice. Since this one isn’t as cut and dry as others, I think it’s an interesting talking point anyhow.
I lean heavily progressive, (legalization of all drugs, prostitution etc) and I am happy people are finally becoming 'comfortable' coming out about their prior experiences to help shed light on a terrible epidemic of Men using their power to take advantage of others.
How do you separate the person from the band? I think everyone has the right to feel however they want about each situation. For example, Brand New is one of my top 10 bands of all time, I despise Jessie Lacy for all the shit he did, but I can't find myself hating Brand New, their music is too personal for me to let go. With that being said, I very rarely recommend them to anyone and try to limit my public exposure to them, which sucks because their music is amazing but also it sucks for the life he ruined, because he made a horrendous decision and it impacted the life/lives of a woman..
So I think everyone should be able to freely discuss their feelings about each mishap, but I think we should leave it at the band/person and not at other listeners who may or may not still listen to their music. Music is personal, it makes everyone feel differently, and if their music still makes you feel good, then good for you, and if the horrendous incident makes it to where you can't appreciate them anymore, then also good for you.
I think the most important thing we can do is be aware, be aware that this is happening and to take it into consideration when recommending or listening to, don't make excuses for them, accept the fact that a band/person from a band made a terrible life decision and move forward with however you feel best. But please don't demonize someone (you have the right to lose respect for someone based on these factors) else for liking their music just because you don't agree with what happened, you never know how much a song/album means to someone.
TrainFan73
Frothy
I agree with all of this and I don’t mean to demonize anyone.
I think this forum should be a safe place in general. We all struggle with these issues as our heroes fall or rise.
This group in this thread has dedicated themselves to an in-depth look at an album every week and this week’s album happens to fit in this larger narrative that has been in the music fan’s conversations since I delved deep in 2015. I think it’s interesting.
blissfullychaotic
Well-Known Member
Opps my bad didn't mean to make it seem like I was saying you were demonizing someone, meant more so in general that if someone were to agree or disagree it's best not to demonize them. <3
TrainFan73
Frothy
I didn’t really think you were. I just wanted to be clear.
Taevis
Active Member
So I listened to The Seer for the first time in months, since it’s this week’s album and my pic so I wanted it fresh in my head to discuss, and I think it grew on me even more.
I think there’s a story going on throughout the album almost like it’s one of those movies where a monster destroys everything and then a hero rises up to defeat it. I think this narrative is most clear in songs like Lunacy, The Seer, 93 Ave. Blues, Song for a Warrior, and Avatar.
My favorite moment on the album is probably Song for a Warrior. It caught me so off guard when I heard it for the first time because there was a woman’s voice and it was a nice, sweet ballad as opposed to the brutal pummeling that most of the album provides.
I think there’s a story going on throughout the album almost like it’s one of those movies where a monster destroys everything and then a hero rises up to defeat it. I think this narrative is most clear in songs like Lunacy, The Seer, 93 Ave. Blues, Song for a Warrior, and Avatar.
My favorite moment on the album is probably Song for a Warrior. It caught me so off guard when I heard it for the first time because there was a woman’s voice and it was a nice, sweet ballad as opposed to the brutal pummeling that most of the album provides.
Bohnjaggs
Well-Known Member
Taevis
Active Member
I honestly had no idea about any rape accusations toward Gira. I’m saddened to be honest. As a person, he’s lost my respect. As a musician though, that’s a different story, for Swans has become one of my favorite bands, and accusations don’t change how good their music is, at least for me.
Sonicpharmacist
Well-Known Member
I remember when Larkin made the accusations several years ago, and I was disgusted yet conflicted. It seemed obvious that Michael made a transgression, as he later admitted, but I really didn’t know what to make of the rape accusation at the time. With the #metoo movement, I’ve become much more aware of rape culture, and stand by the “believe the women” motto, which has led me to believe Larkin. Perhaps it was more that I didn’t *want* to believe that one of my favorite musicians could be a rapist. I don’t really know, honestly, but somehow I’m able to separate this horrible incident from his music.
chrb98
Active Member
The Seer is definitely in my top 5 albums of all time, probably even top 3 if I had to really think about it. And while there are a multitude of reasons why I love this album, the aspect that keeps me coming back is just how awe-inspiring and grand it is. Gira has stated before that The Seer is, in many ways, a culmination of all the previous decades of Swans, and it shines through in the music. It’s a truly epic album - to be expected from its nearly 2-hour runtime, sure, but the breadth and scope is unparalleled throughout all of Swans’s discography. From the mixing, to the mountains of guitars layered atop every song, to the variety of the instrumentation sprinkled throughout, to even the ambient sounds (such as fire crackling and leaves rustlings) that help to set the mood, this album feels like a massive, eons-old world that claws you deep into its atmosphere. The primal raw energy that serves as the sole similarity throughout Swans’s vast discography works perfectly in tandem with the suspenseful drones, the swelling climaxes, and the beautifully crushing nature brought on by the post-rock leanings previously flirted with on Soundtracks For The Blind. This album is just as carnal as it is universal, and rather than these two moods contrasting each other, they come together perfectly. The droning may be a turn-off to some, and that’s valid, but the spiritual and almost religious nature of it really helps to tie this album together in a godlike way.
For the record, I do like To Be Kind and The Glowing Man as well. But whereas those albums (particularly the former) feel like a band composing really good post-rock music together, The Seer feels so much more cosmic, so much more divine, and so much bigger. It has its flaws - the title track drags on a bit too long for my tastes, and The Daughter Brings The Water leaves a bit to be desired. But overall, the pure power and scope brought on by this album, and the feeling and atmosphere it conjures up, makes it one of my favorite albums ever
For the record, I do like To Be Kind and The Glowing Man as well. But whereas those albums (particularly the former) feel like a band composing really good post-rock music together, The Seer feels so much more cosmic, so much more divine, and so much bigger. It has its flaws - the title track drags on a bit too long for my tastes, and The Daughter Brings The Water leaves a bit to be desired. But overall, the pure power and scope brought on by this album, and the feeling and atmosphere it conjures up, makes it one of my favorite albums ever
Sonicpharmacist
Well-Known Member
The Seer feels more like it was meant to be taken in as a whole piece of music rather than individual tracks, like To Be Kind. And I agree, not all of it works. I find myself skipping A Piece or Sky (the field recordings go on too long), and while it sets the proper tone, Lunacy is a weak track to open the album. But the good is fucking fantastic. The Apostate kills me every time.