Equipment Recommendations - The Home For New System and Upgrade Advice

duke86fan said:
well i have no hifi shops nearby and im not spending 300 bucks to figure out which of the 2 i want
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No matter. Many shops don’t allow demoing cartridges anyway.

When I was in the business, things happened:

The sales guy would “throw in” a “free” cartridge with the purchase of a cartridge when the turntable was sold at list price.

Or a turntable was sold at a great price- sometimes half, when purchased with a “selected” cartridge at list. Selected meant the one we selected for you.

You are far better off listening to those who choose to help you for free. But you have to listen.
 
Lord Diaper Baby said:
@duke86fan What's your cart buying timeline? You note that you don't want to buy two carts to figure out which one you want - if I'm gathering my info correctly is it down to a 2M Blue and some AT (FWIW, I've had Ortofons and ATs and don't have a prob w/ Ortofons but think AT is a better brand).

Any how, I ask about your timeline b/c I THINK (I'm like 99% sure) I have a 2M Blue collecting dust (not really I keep my shit tight) in a drawer. I haven't used it in a couple years and it probably has ~100 or so hours on it. I won't be back to my system till March, but if you wanna spend your own $ on the AT (or whatever else you were looking at) then I'll PIF the 2M (again, 99% sure it actually exists). I don't have any plans on selling it; I don't really have any plans for it at all.
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define cart buying timeline

this is my first time buying a new additional cartridge.. i went from an LP60 with the stock cartridge to a grado black on a uturn orbit to now seeing which one would be good to get... and no you dont have to PIF it... at the VERY least i will wait until that march because i wont have the money until at least october or november (im making 40 bucks a week soon so it wont be that long)
 
duke86fan said:
define cart buying timeline

this is my first time buying a new additional cartridge.. i went from an LP60 with the stock cartridge to a grado black on a uturn orbit to now seeing which one would be good to get... and no you dont have to PIF it... at the VERY least i will wait until that march because i wont have the money until at least october or november (im making 40 bucks a week soon so it wont be that long)
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Yes, by timeline I meant when you are looking to get a new one.

That's fine. Truth is, I have some audio gear that I need to get rid of. I usually keep a back up phonostage and cart lying around in case something happens (basically I keep the last one I had when I upgrade); but b/c I haven't been getting rid of stuff I now have back-ups to back-ups for some stuff and I don't need that. A more expensive cart (or gear, in general) I would resell; but a used 2M Blue I'd rather have it go to a good home for free than to a stranger through a sale and make like, what, >$100.

Regardless, I'll probably PIF it sometime in the spring. Imma @ you when that time comes. I won't be insulted if you don't take it. Someone will get it.
 
duke86fan said:
thats why i wasn't going to buy from amazon but LP gear or music direct (why not cut out the bezos in general)

and i just have dumb "the audiotechnica doesn't have the notoriety" reasons (basically im insecure)
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Totally get that. I was coming of a Nagaoka which has hairy, reclusive men across the world creaming themselves in to oblivion. The AT I moved to was partly of necessity as the whole cart was less than I would have paid for a replacement stylus for my MP200 and I went through the whole 'but nagoakas are made in a niche setting and cost loads where as AT made those headphones that absolute knacker on the bus was wearing last week'... But I'm pleased I did. Its great and gives me a generally more rounded experience than the nagaoka did.

So they're cool and sound great. Probably won't win any one upmanship contests with the Cartridge Wanker gang but if it sounds like you like sounds to sound then surely that's cool.
 
Rowan said:
Totally get that. I was coming of a Nagaoka which has hairy, reclusive men across the world creaming themselves in to oblivion. The AT I moved to was partly of necessity as the whole cart was less than I would have paid for a replacement stylus for my MP200 and I went through the whole 'but nagoakas are made in a niche setting and cost loads where as AT made those headphones that absolute knacker on the bus was wearing last week'... But I'm pleased I did. Its great and gives me a generally more rounded experience than the nagaoka did.

So they're cool and sound great. Probably won't win any one upmanship contests with the Cartridge Wanker gang but if it sounds like you like sounds to sound then surely that's cool.
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what audio technica would you recommend... its that, nagaoka or ortofon for me, i just want something i know will work on my uturn (less than 7.2g) and has a more detailed sound than the grado i have and less muddy in the mid bass
 
duke86fan said:
what audio technica would you recommend... its that, nagaoka or ortofon for me, i just want something i know will work on my uturn (less than 7.2g) and has a more detailed sound than the grado i have and less muddy in the mid bass
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Totally different setup to yours but a mate has a 95ml on his pioneer and it sounds fantastic. Pretty sure he said he paid less than 100 quid for it too (English) . That's what actually pushed me down the AT route. Looks like the 540ml is a little bit more than the Ortofon Blue but all the reviews said that it gives nearly exactly the same sound as the 740ml I'm playing with but without the metal body. You might be able to find a NOS 440ml too as, again from reviews, the difference between that and the 740 is supposed to be pretty negligible.

Buying new stuff is crap though. I spent weeks going through reviews before I pulled the trigger on mine. I actually think I spent more hours trying to work out whether I should but this cart than I did when I was deciding whether I should buy my house.

Just had a look at LP gear and the 540 is 30 dollars more than the blue. That's actually a much closer price than I can get in the UK. This is only my view but its a much, much better cart for the equivilant (or less) of a VMP exclusive. Definitely worth a ponder.
 
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Rowan said:
Totally different setup to yours but a mate has a 95ml on his pioneer and it sounds fantastic. Pretty sure he said he paid less than 100 quid for it too (English) . That's what actually pushed me down the AT route. Looks like the 540ml is a little bit more than the Ortofon Blue but all the reviews said that it gives nearly exactly the same sound as the 740ml I'm playing with but without the metal body. You might be able to find a NOS 440ml too as, again from reviews, the difference between that and the 740 is supposed to be pretty negligible.

Buying new stuff is crap though. I spent weeks going through reviews before I pulled the trigger on mine. I actually think I spent more hours trying to work out whether I should but this cart than I did when I was deciding whether I should buy my house.

Just had a look at LP gear and the 540 is 30 dollars more than the blue. That's actually a much closer price than I can get in the UK. This is only my view but its a much, much better cart for the equivilant (or less) of a VMP exclusive. Definitely worth a ponder.
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ok.. that is tempting... 250 seems like a lot but for only 30 more than the ortofon blue (even though i might be getting a blue used). it could be useful
 
For what it's worth, I landed on an AT shibata for my SL1210 after trying out lower end Shures, Ortofon and Nagaoka and I have no desire to change any more (well, I'll eventually have to get an equivalent stylus since my model is discontinued, but the new stylus fit in my cart) .

I'm happy, just enjoying records and stopped over thinking it. I like the balance between detail and not revealing too much imperfections.
 
debianlinux said:
I resent the notion that hairy, creamy men are anything less than the best the world has to offer.
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Your “grin and Bear it” bumper sticker is in the mail

Turbo said:
For what it's worth, I landed on an AT shibata for my SL1210 after trying out lower end Shures, Ortofon and Nagaoka and I have no desire to change any more (well, I'll eventually have to get an equivalent stylus since my model is discontinued, but the new stylus fit in my cart) .

I'm happy, just enjoying records and stopped over thinking it. I like the balance between detail and not revealing too much imperfections.
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My only concern here is that Shibatas are notoriously finicky to set up perfectly, and I don’t know if the U-Turn tonearm has all the necessary adjustments.
 
duke86fan said:
but they had to make sure it was amazing and even better by modifying it... that is the only logical explanation
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I wish I had video tape of some of the boardroom discussions I have been part of. Some product decisions are started by engineering saying "I think I know how we can make something better." That does happen.
But 99 out of 100 times executives go to product designers and say "I need you to make something equal or up to 10% worse, at 50% less cost. We see a market gap, and with the right messaging we can actually sell this for even more than our last product. We just need you to make no noticeably worse at half the cost so we can have double the margin and we can move a boatload of these."

A huge percentage of the time it's not about being better, it's about being different, unique, and not worse. Your reactions of reviews and marketing language combined with your view points of brands is a marketers wet dream. They are hitting you with all the right messaging.

I'm not saying any of the products are bad. The fact of the matter is these products get praise because they are all good. But I can sincerely promise you that when it comes to big corporations, "better" is rarely the objective.
 
displayname said:
A huge percentage of the time it's not about being better, it's about being different, unique, and not worse. Your reactions of reviews and marketing language combined with your view points of brands is a marketers wet dream. They are hitting you with all the right messaging.
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dammit capitalism is working on me

if i got something as much detail as the ortofon while still being warm and textured (aka there isn't this feeling of muddiness in the bass. i wonder if its resonance), id buy it in a heartbeat

also i like easy because then i dont have to think.. thinking not fun
 
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duke86fan said:
much detail as the ortofon while still being warm and textured
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Fortunately, those types of things do exist. Unfortunately they cost more. There's always a trade off somewhere. You've just got to decide what means most to you within your price point.

But here's something more encouraging that I simply cannot state enough - most products are pretty decent products for their respective price points. When you make an upgrade, there is a good chance you're going to like it because it simply is in a class above what you previously had.
 
displayname said:
Fortunately, those types of things do exist. Unfortunately they cost more. There's always a trade off somewhere. You've just got to decide what means most to you within your price point.

But here's something more encouraging that I simply cannot state enough - most products are pretty decent products for their respective price points. When you make an upgrade, there is a good chance you're going to like it because it simply is in a class above what you previously had.
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ok yeah.. that kinda sucks.. the only thing i really majorly want is less muddiness in the bass and mids (specifically on hard rock records it all blends in)
 
AnthonyI said:
Just out of curiosity, what's one hard rock album that your getting the muddy base on?
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team dresch compilation album (it feels a bit too dark, needs a little more treble), queens of the stone age SFTD. the harder songs on fetch the bolt cutters, etc.
 
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