A (different) Conversation About The Technics 1200 Mk2 -5

psemeraro

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Orlando, FL
Hi friends, this is my first official post, thanks for welcoming me to the forum.

I recently purchased a spare 1200Mk2, it is the 11th 1200Mk2 I've owned, 6 of them for my DJ business starting in 1990, two of them at my last business (an AV company) two for my radio station, and now the spare so I can rotate them out and do some maintenance. I have a very un-emotional relationship with the 1200, which is unusual as the 1200 Mk2-5 is the most loved/hated turntable of all time. They are surrounded by legend and myth, here I simply offer truth.

When the 1200Mk2 arrived in 1979, there was nothing quite like it. It was part of Technics "professional" series but was sort of an orphan product with the intent of bringing "professional" performance to the home market. The professional market gobbled it up along with audiophiles and 3 million units later it can be considered the most successful turntable of all time. Everybody should own one for the sake of history, with the caveat that most used examples in 2021 are in need of serious maintenance and probably a lot of work is necessary to make them sound like did after leaving the factory.

It is a masterpiece of mechanical engineering, and having used SP10Mk2's at my first radio station, the 1200Mk2 brought a level of function and accurate speed that hinted of the Sp10's to the mass market. It is remarkably resistant to acoustic feedback, speed is accurate, startup is fast, the arm geometry is good, and the 1200 Mk2 set a standard that I believe forced other manufacturers offer better turntables to the market.

We've learned a lot since 1979 and these days we pay attention to acoustical engineering along with mechanical precision.

THE SOUND A properly working 1200 has a very distinct sound. It is quiet, competent, and good, but is the sum of a "dark" sounding plinth and a bright, "ringy" sounding tonearm. (Technics knew how to make a great arm, the EPA100 is legendary but on its own cost more than a 1200Mk2) Low compliance cartridges that put a lot of energy back into the arm will sound quite different than they do on a one piece arm like a Rega or something more stout like an SME V. Because of the mechanical precision, low compliance cartridges work and track just fine, but you are hearing the cartridge and the arm as a system vs the true sound of the cartridge on a better more neutral arm.

Most tonearms sound bad and the 1200 Mk2 due to its mechanical precision is better than many but there is more nuance to the conversation than the "it sounds great/it sounds terrible" reputation that the 1200 has developed over time.

It is a good platform to "mod" and there are real gains to be had although I believe many of the available mods are misguided. In 2021 the first "mod" should be a full recap of the electronics and disassembly/reassembly of the tonearm and readjustment of the gimbals to get it back to factory spec. It is not perfect but it is good and might be better than what you are using currently, and is an important part of history.

And it's still relevant in 2021, that in itself is amazing. I'm glad to answer any questions about the 1200 Mk2 from impressions, to how to repair, etc.

Pat
 
Hi Pat, thanks for the background info, and welcome to N&G!

I've got a question for you. I have a 1200 mk2 that I picked up from Craigslist a few years ago that spent most of its life working for a college radio station. According to the person who sold it to me, they had it serviced at The Needle Doctor (RIP) here in the Twin Cities. The one thing they didn't/couldn't fix is the seized up VTA dial.

I've tried careful brute force and penetrating oil, which didn't do a thing. Any suggestions to free it up that aren't too risky? It's not a dire situation, as its height is set for the Grado Black that came with it, and I'm perfectly content running the Gold3 I have on it now forever if need be. Thanks!
 
Hi. The good news is with elliptical styli you have some leeway with vta. Do you have any idea what work was done to the unit?

To fix the seized helicoil I would remove the tonearm completely from the deck, then unsolder the wires on the pcb (after taking a photo of course) then remove the arm wand completely. With just the base remaining I would use kroil Kroil Penetrant (formerly AeroKroil and SiliKroil) and apply to the helicoil from the top and bottom for several days after which it will either free up, or you'll need to use some tools to get it to move. Once it moves I would completely disassemble, clean, relube (KAB has the correct lube or you can use vasoline) and reassemble. What I'm describing is not a job for everyone and could cost $$ at a competent shop based on the time alone.

If it was my deck, I would start with kroil from the top for several days. I would then grab a towel and a large pair of plumbers pliers, wrap the towel around the plastic collar, grip the collar (with the towel on it) with the pliers and test my luck. (Pliers built for sink drains with their large circular openings and long handles are the only pliers I would attempt to use) The long handle of the the plumbers pliers gives both leverage and control. If a reasonable force didn't move the collar and free up the assembly, then I would move to the next step of disassembling everything. I would undertake step one clearly understanding the risk of breaking the collar, and obviously make some judgements along the way.

Anther option is to just let it be... hope this helps.

Pat
 
Hi. The good news is with elliptical styli you have some leeway with vta. Do you have any idea what work was done to the unit?

To fix the seized helicoil I would remove the tonearm completely from the deck, then unsolder the wires on the pcb (after taking a photo of course) then remove the arm wand completely. With just the base remaining I would use kroil Kroil Penetrant (formerly AeroKroil and SiliKroil) and apply to the helicoil from the top and bottom for several days after which it will either free up, or you'll need to use some tools to get it to move. Once it moves I would completely disassemble, clean, relube (KAB has the correct lube or you can use vasoline) and reassemble. What I'm describing is not a job for everyone and could cost $$ at a competent shop based on the time alone.

If it was my deck, I would start with kroil from the top for several days. I would then grab a towel and a large pair of plumbers pliers, wrap the towel around the plastic collar, grip the collar (with the towel on it) with the pliers and test my luck. (Pliers built for sink drains with their large circular openings and long handles are the only pliers I would attempt to use) The long handle of the the plumbers pliers gives both leverage and control. If a reasonable force didn't move the collar and free up the assembly, then I would move to the next step of disassembling everything. I would undertake step one clearly understanding the risk of breaking the collar, and obviously make some judgements along the way.

Anther option is to just let it be... hope this helps.

Pat
Thanks for the advice! I have enough experience that I could probably manage the unsolder/resolder work, but I like the idea of the Kroil step first, to see if that does it by itself. Just to confirm, are you saying the Kroil/plier attempt could be done with just the tonearm removed, or would it be reasonable to try this with the deck still fully assembled? (I acknowledge that you can't vouch for my level of care and control and the risk posed to the table when trying it)
 
Hi. The good news is with elliptical styli you have some leeway with vta. Do you have any idea what work was done to the unit?

To fix the seized helicoil I would remove the tonearm completely from the deck, then unsolder the wires on the pcb (after taking a photo of course) then remove the arm wand completely. With just the base remaining I would use kroil Kroil Penetrant (formerly AeroKroil and SiliKroil) and apply to the helicoil from the top and bottom for several days after which it will either free up, or you'll need to use some tools to get it to move. Once it moves I would completely disassemble, clean, relube (KAB has the correct lube or you can use vasoline) and reassemble. What I'm describing is not a job for everyone and could cost $$ at a competent shop based on the time alone.

If it was my deck, I would start with kroil from the top for several days. I would then grab a towel and a large pair of plumbers pliers, wrap the towel around the plastic collar, grip the collar (with the towel on it) with the pliers and test my luck. (Pliers built for sink drains with their large circular openings and long handles are the only pliers I would attempt to use) The long handle of the the plumbers pliers gives both leverage and control. If a reasonable force didn't move the collar and free up the assembly, then I would move to the next step of disassembling everything. I would undertake step one clearly understanding the risk of breaking the collar, and obviously make some judgements along the way.

Anther option is to just let it be... hope this helps.

Pat
Pat,

For someone that has a working working VTA riser/ring would you advise adjusting the arm up and down occasionally to stop it from seizing, or should the assembly be occasionally cleaned of old grease and relubed?
 
Thanks for the advice! I have enough experience that I could probably manage the unsolder/resolder work, but I like the idea of the Kroil step first, to see if that does it by itself. Just to confirm, are you saying the Kroil/plier attempt could be done with just the tonearm removed, or would it be reasonable to try this with the deck still fully assembled? (I acknowledge that you can't vouch for my level of care and control and the risk posed to the table when trying it)
It it were me... I would try the kroil and pliers with the deck fully assembled first. I also have a big box of 1200 parts and have done this before so please take what I say with care. It's entirely possible here that a working 1200 could end up broken and I don't want to be responsible for breaking your turntable.
Pat
 
Pat,

For someone that has a working working VTA riser/ring would you advise adjusting the arm up and down occasionally to stop it from seizing, or should the assembly be occasionally cleaned of old grease and relubed?
Absolutely it should occasionally be worked up and down. As for maintenance, (my view) if it works, its fine. Taking apart the helicoil is far from my idea of fun but to each their own. In use, once you find a spot you like, it gets locked down and that's it.
Pat
 
I have a 1200 mk2 ... spent most of its life working for a college radio station.
A few things I would do if you're interested in good sound quality.

Your thrust plate is likely quite worn. KAB has a fix for those KAB Electro Acoustics http://www.kabusa.com

The upside down L piece on the tonearm that holds the upper vertical bearing on top and secures the assembly together on the bottom is fastened via two Phillips screws from underneath. Those screws are accessed via removing the bottom cover (where the lead wires pass thru) on the tonearm. The tension on those two screws is responsible much of the good or bad sound of a 1200's arm. It is the only point where the bearing and arm assembly sinks to the plinth; the 1200 arm actually "floats" inside the base assembly except for where that L bracket contacts. The tighter and more secure you can make that mechanical connection, the better your deck will sound. Dynamics, clarity, image width and depth and more, all live or die starting at that spot. Long before anyone starts talking about fluid dampers and cables, that primary mechanical connection needs to be perfect.

If you are handy/adventurous, the next step would be remove the arm assembly completely and re-tighten (and if necessary repair) all the tiny little screws that hold the arm together. The two screws under the headshell collar are especially problematic. Muddy lower midrange and a flat, 2d stereo image are the result of loose screws and/or out of adjustment gimball bearings.

The gimballs are the final step and there are two adjustment points of interest, the top gimball and the oustide side gimball. I put a few drops of 10/30 Amsoil in the gimballs and adjust until they feel tight and friction free, then add 1/4 additional turn of tension, and secure the outer locking screw. In 2021 I care more about a quiet bearing than ultimately low friction. It still feels "friction free" but would probably measure slightly higher than Technics oem friction spec just from the lubricant alone.

The 1200Mk2 arm, when working correctly is a bright (I call it 'zingy') fun sounding arm with decent separation in the mid and high frequencies and depending on headshell/cart combo also some image depth. Unfortunately, in 2021 many 1200 arms sound muddy, blurry, edgy and 2d due to their current condition.

Pat
 
Thanks for the advice! I have enough experience that I could probably manage the unsolder/resolder work, but I like the idea of the Kroil step first, to see if that does it by itself. Just to confirm, are you saying the Kroil/plier attempt could be done with just the tonearm removed, or would it be reasonable to try this with the deck still fully assembled? (I acknowledge that you can't vouch for my level of care and control and the risk posed to the table when trying it)
If your deck is stock, there is one "service loop" of tonearm wire at the PC board. The first time I tried soldering tonearm wires it didn't go well... you need a point tip and just the right heat or the wires will evaporate in front of your eyes. If you've worked with tonearm wires before then disregard this message. If you haven't, then just imagine soldering human hair and you'll be in the ballpark.
Pat
 
A few things I would do if you're interested in good sound quality.

Your thrust plate is likely quite worn. KAB has a fix for those KAB Electro Acoustics http://www.kabusa.com

The upside down L piece on the tonearm that holds the upper vertical bearing on top and secures the assembly together on the bottom is fastened via two Phillips screws from underneath. Those screws are accessed via removing the bottom cover (where the lead wires pass thru) on the tonearm. The tension on those two screws is responsible much of the good or bad sound of a 1200's arm. It is the only point where the bearing and arm assembly sinks to the plinth; the 1200 arm actually "floats" inside the base assembly except for where that L bracket contacts. The tighter and more secure you can make that mechanical connection, the better your deck will sound. Dynamics, clarity, image width and depth and more, all live or die starting at that spot. Long before anyone starts talking about fluid dampers and cables, that primary mechanical connection needs to be perfect.

If you are handy/adventurous, the next step would be remove the arm assembly completely and re-tighten (and if necessary repair) all the tiny little screws that hold the arm together. The two screws under the headshell collar are especially problematic. Muddy lower midrange and a flat, 2d stereo image are the result of loose screws and/or out of adjustment gimball bearings.

The gimballs are the final step and there are two adjustment points of interest, the top gimball and the oustide side gimball. I put a few drops of 10/30 Amsoil in the gimballs and adjust until they feel tight and friction free, then add 1/4 additional turn of tension, and secure the outer locking screw. In 2021 I care more about a quiet bearing than ultimately low friction. It still feels "friction free" but would probably measure slightly higher than Technics oem friction spec just from the lubricant alone.

The 1200Mk2 arm, when working correctly is a bright (I call it 'zingy') fun sounding arm with decent separation in the mid and high frequencies and depending on headshell/cart combo also some image depth. Unfortunately, in 2021 many 1200 arms sound muddy, blurry, edgy and 2d due to their current condition.

Pat
I've been itching for a DIY audio project, so you may have convinced me to make it my 1200. I really appreciate all the well reasoned info.
 
I've been itching for a DIY audio project, so you may have convinced me to make it my 1200. I really appreciate all the well reasoned info.
I’ll vouch for @psemeraro and his talent with SL-1200s. The tables at the station won’t win any beauty contests, but they work extremely well, and sound good too.

Edit: He’s also likely forgotten more about vintage cartridges than I’ll ever know. He knows Stanton, Pickering, Ortofon and Shure forwards and backwards. Likely more too.
 
I’ll vouch for @psemeraro and his talent with SL-1200s. The tables at the station won’t win any beauty contests, but they work extremely well, and sound good too.

Edit: He’s also likely forgotten more about vintage cartridges than I’ll ever know. He knows Stanton, Pickering, Ortofon and Shure forwards and backwards. Likely more too.
Transducers are fun, they combine science and art, and they are full of flaws. I find them endlessly fascinating.
 
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