Political Discussion

TenderLovingKiller® said:

If you want to rag on the media for not covering candidates war vote (also, Mayor Pete May have killed people in the actual war, I don’t think he has done anything to actually propagate war) I am on board but the argument as laid out seem more like whataboutism as a way to deflect the larger concern here about a small yet very vocal portion of Bernie supporters being toxic online.

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I get it and it is a form of whataboutism, but I believe it's valid. Where should more concern go? Is it reasonable to prioritize online buying over bombing a country into oblivion (Iraq, Yemen, Afghanistan) and then starving them with sanctions? There is a grater violence going on here and prioritizing online bullying over actual destruction of people's lives.

NateOEB said:

The name seems to be a wholesale way to write off the coalition of supporters he has built. Are there names for supporters of any of the other candidates used this way?

I see a lot more complaining about Bernie Bro behavior than I see the behavior, maybe I'm not involved in the conversations where it's happening though.

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I am a Bernie supporter who spends a good amount of time online and it’s been my experience that, while I agree that the media does some broad brush painting when using the term, is a real thing. The Bros. Use many of the same internet techniques that lots of the more toxic communities use online to bully and intimidate critics. It’s the same shit many of the folks on the left have complained about for years but since their cause is righteous some on the left are quick to excuse their actions. I now see lots of people claiming it is not a thing or not a big deal because the media is lazy and exaggerates the online presence of Bernie Bros, but that dismisses the actual issue.

Bernie did the right thing at the debate by condemning and disavowing their actions. He also, did a bad thing or raising the specter of Russian trolls (which is probably a bit of it but is best left out of statement condemning the acts). He should stay on top of it a bit and hopefully as voters begin to coalesce around him as the nominee we supporters will do a better job calling out the BS when we see it happening.

Dtknuckles said:

I get it and it is a form of whataboutism, but I believe it's valid. Where should more concern go? Is it reasonable to prioritize online buying over bombing a country into oblivion (Iraq, Yemen, Afghanistan) and then starving them with sanctions? There is a grater violence going on here and prioritizing online bullying over actual destruction of people's lives.

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I agree but we have the ability to many thoughts and concerns in our heads at one time. If someone does something shitty to someone else I am not gonna say “well, That sucks but there are people being carpet bombed in Syria so fuck it”. If you are saying the corporate media does an awful job prioritizing the news they choose to cover, I agree. I just don’t think bad one act excuses or lessens another. Two wrongs don’t make a right.

TenderLovingKiller® said:

I agree but we have the ability to many thoughts and concerns in our heads at one time. If someone does something shitty to someone else I am not gonna say “well, That sucks but there are people being carpet bombed in Syria so fuck it”. If you are saying the corporate media does an awful job prioritizing the news they choose to cover, I agree. I just don’t think bad one act excuses or lessens another. Two wrongs don’t make a right.

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You are right we can have two concerns at one time. I'm not advocating for dismissing online bullying, but we should react to it in ways that are proportionate to the damage that it causes. I work in schools so I have seen how online bullying can be a traumatic experience, but does it compare to begin starved to death because of sanctions and bombed into oblivion. No. The fact that the media prioritized Bernie Bro's over his actual policies that reduce violence is well...stupid. He has no control over what the internet does. Yes he can denounce it, but other than that what can he do? All of his policies treat all people with the respect they deserve. Why don't they talk about that as well as the Bernie Bro incidents?

Dtknuckles said:

You are right we can have two concerns at one time. I'm not advocating for dismissing online bullying, but we should react to it in ways that are proportionate to the damage that it causes. I work in schools so I have seen how online bullying can be a traumatic experience, but does it compare to begin starved to death because of sanctions and bombed into oblivion. No. The fact that the media prioritized Bernie Bro's over his actual policies that reduce violence is well...stupid. He has no control over what the internet does. Yes he can denounce it, but other than that what can he do? All of his policies treat all people with the respect they deserve. Why don't they talk about that as well as the Bernie Bro incidents?

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I agree corporate media is a lot of times sensationalist ratings driven clickbait. The media has sensationalized the Bernie Bros. Storyline and in turn many Bernie supporters are pushing back a little too hard the other direction as if it is all overblown hype (which it certainly is not). Bernie is the leader of his movement, many of his supporters will take their queues from how he responds when things are misguidedly done in name of his movement. The more he condemns (and he should be very specific to what he is condemning) the less these toxic acts will occur.

jaycee said:

We all knew this already. Right?

The Great Affordability Crisis Breaking America

In one of the best decades the American economy has ever recorded, families were bled dry.

www.theatlantic.com

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I shared this article on an other forum and got a very OK Boomer like reply.

Not really. Just, as in many cases, people are just making poor life choices.

Why does a guy working at a car wash washing cars need a $1000+ iPhone as well as $250 earpods? His choice, but a poor long-term one.

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Yup, that's right. The affordability crisis is because we make poor financial decisions and could be solved if only spend out money on things that are deemed a necessity.

RenegadeMonster said:

I shared this article on an other forum and got a very OK Boomer like reply.




Yup, that's right. The affordability crisis is because we make poor financial decisions and could be solved if only spend out money on things that are deemed a necessity.

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With the payment plans, they are usually paying an extra $30-40 a month for the wide array of things access to the internet provides. It's actually pretty cheap considering what you get access to. In a lot of ways it makes us more efficient. Also everybody needs the distractions and entertainment to remain happy. Satisfaction is part of productiveness.

RenegadeMonster said:

I shared this article on an other forum and got a very OK Boomer like reply.




Yup, that's right. The affordability crisis is because we make poor financial decisions and could be solved if only spend out money on things that are deemed a necessity.

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Boomer here and I just can't understand Boomers

RenegadeMonster said:

I shared this article on an other forum and got a very OK Boomer like reply.




Yup, that's right. The affordability crisis is because we make poor financial decisions and could be solved if only spend out money on things that are deemed a necessity.

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like grandma-ma used to say. You can't clean that kind-of stupid off.

Dtknuckles said:

With the payment plans, they are usually paying an extra $30-40 a month for the wide array of things access to the internet provides. It's actually pretty cheap considering what you get access to. In a lot of ways it makes us more efficient. Also everybody needs the distractions and entertainment to remain happy. Satisfaction is part of productiveness.

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human well-being is not valued by capitalism

Breaking. Bernie Sanders has stated that he has been informed that there is evidence that Russia is interfering in the 2020 elections by boosting Bernie Sanders Campaign. The thought is if they push Bernie Sanders into being the nominee he would be the weakest candidate against Trump because he's now going to draw the support of independents or moderates.

Glad Bernie is admitting to it and is transparent. Meanwhile the same report listed that Russia is also interfering by boosting Trump's Campaign. Trump has flat out denied this.

jaycee said:

like grandma-ma used to say. You can't clean that kind-of stupid off.

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Sighs, I tried to explain the affordability crisis to this person using my real life example.

Someone else chimed in giving me examples of my poor financial decisions and the affordability crisis I'm facing is of my own making.

For example. I was told the following:

• You have freely admitted to living in a high-rent area. You could always choose to live somewhere else in the country where rent is more affordable.
• You freely admit to living on your own and not sharing boarding costs with a roommate for no reasons other than your person preference to not have a roommate.
• You have freely admitted to having a huge amount of student loan debt. You consciously chose to borrow more than what you could reasonably afford to pay back.
• You have freely admitted to about owning an iMac, iPhone and a iPad on other posts on this forum. These are luxury items and not necessities.
• You have recently complained about Comcast charging you $112 a month for internet after offering you the same package for $90. Internet is not a necessity. You could go without it.

Sighs. I don't think there is anything I can say in the forum primarily made up of boomers to sway these boomers predetermined opinions.

The fact that I made a comparison about rent being a much higher percentage of salaries today than it was 30 years ago was dismissed. That's not what's squeezing affordability for me. It's the fact that I don't have a roommate. It's where I chose to live. Also I had the audacity to buy Apple Devices. I'm not going crazy spending money on Apple Devices. I bought my iMac in 2013 with cash, and got the lowest end one for $1200 at the time. I don't upgrade my iPhones as often as I can. I have only ever owned 2 iPads. And I only upgraded because my old one died.

Also, having the iMac and Internet are a necessity for me. I need them for working from home and freelance work.

RenegadeMonster said:

Sighs, I tried to explain the affordability crisis to this person using my real life example.

Someone else chimed in giving me examples of my poor financial decisions and the affordability crisis I'm facing is of my own making.

For example. I was told the following:

• You have freely admitted to living in a high-rent area. You could always choose to live somewhere else in the country where rent is more affordable.
• You freely admit to living on your own and not sharing boarding costs with a roommate for no reasons other than your person preference to not have a roommate.
• You have freely admitted to having a huge amount of student loan debt. You consciously chose to borrow more than what you could reasonably afford to pay back.
• You have freely admitted to about owning an iMac, iPhone and a iPad on other posts on this forum. These are luxury items and not necessities.
• You have recently complained about Comcast charging you $112 a month for internet after offering you the same package for $90. Internet is not a necessity. You could go without it.

Sighs. I don't think there is anything I can say in the forum primarily made up of boomers to sway these boomers predetermined opinions.

The fact that I made a comparison about rent being a much higher percentage of salaries today than it was 30 years ago was dismissed. That's not what's squeezing affordability for me. It's the fact that I don't have a roommate. It's where I chose to live. Also I had the audacity to buy Apple Devices. I'm not going crazy spending money on Apple Devices. I bought my iMac in 2013 with cash, and got the lowest end one for $1200 at the time. I don't upgrade my iPhones as often as I can. I have only ever owned 2 iPads. And I only upgraded because my old one died.

Also, having the iMac and Internet are a necessity for me. I need them for working from home and freelance work.

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Sorry - people are sometimes the worst.

People like that are not interested in understanding something they're interested in being right. This is unfortunately a condition of many. Life isn't necessarily easy for anyone and there are lots of people who can't understand their privilege because they're conditioned to look at their lives and think they earned it... and maybe they did but maybe they had an easier time earning it than someone else. Basically the concept of equity is something they don't understand or despise. I mean there are people here on the forum who would probably agree with those comments because they think that you get what you get in life because capitalism means everyone is judged fairly based on how hard they work and that markets are sentient beings that humans with means to do so don't manipulate.

I could go through each one of those arguments and point out how stupid they are but it isn't worth it because people like that will argue that you would be a millionaire if you stopped buying coffee at starbucks. Not that buying individual cups of coffee for $5 a pop is good value but even if you didn't buy that cup every day for 5 years you would only have another 9K. Which isn't nothing but it took you 5 years to earn it or about 7% of your average lifespan. 9K is about 1/2 of your rent for the year if you're living frugally with another person in Boston.

I find the typically Republican argument that you can just move particularly idiotic. All jobs / fields don't exist everywhere and maybe you have family that you actually want to be near. Of course those same people might expect urban areas to fund their rural roads and schools because they don't have the tax base locally to pay for things and it's their god given right to live someplace without jobs. Basically these people are saying that you deserve to be less comfortable than others because you decided to do whatever you do instead of become a financial agent at Merrill Lynch.

ugghh ok i'm done - i don't know what corner of the internet you're hanging in but good luck

I don’t get how Russia can “boost” a campaign. I mean, am I somehow voting Bernie because of Russian mind control or some shit?

debianlinux said:

I don’t get how Russia can “boost” a campaign. I mean, am I somehow voting Bernie because of Russian mind control or some shit?

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No, but they can post and cause positive news to trend on social media, It's social engineering. It's designed so you don't realizing you are being manipulated. It's not all that different from advertisements, good ones anyways. It may not sway anyone fully but it could help solidify support and sure up votes.

debianlinux said:

I don’t get how Russia can “boost” a campaign. I mean, am I somehow voting Bernie because of Russian mind control or some shit?

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You have a couple thousand beuraucracy interns use their front Twitter accounts to around the same time tweet a hashtag, have a couple hundred go around and interact with public figures trying to espouse an opposing or even neutral-but-relevant viewpoint, and it'll turn out nicely. It's more complicated these days, there are a few things The Twitter Algorithm will probably recognize as potential manipulation, but the general principle's the same. Similar to paying people to picket or cropping a photo of a dense-but-small crowd and saying that millions turned out.

For the record, though I would like to see which law Bernie would've broken by releasing the information that he might be getting unwarrented support, which is the main defense I'm seeing used right now, I will be on his train until further notice.

Man, I just got the EOB on my recent Rheumatology visit and my wife’s surgery last week. I knew we made a good decision moving her over to my insurance, but between what an urgent care visit cost us the year before last and the stories here, I have never been more thankful for my insurance. It would be great if everyone had To not worry about medical bills in a similar manner.

I mean my wife works in medicine, too. They knew what they were doing to their employees and she makes more money than me and probably not as much as what she should for her role. You would think they would have a good plan. Just goes to show that this choice bullshit be spouted is just that, bullshit.

Why does this feel so good

Hahaha

Hahaha. The #'s have finally started coming in from the DNC. They are off by 14% points (to Sanders disadvantage) to what the media spotters have been reporting (with 10% precincts in).

Most likely, they are slow dripping (again) from the parts of the state where he did worse. But god damn if this isn't causing flashbacks to Iowa.

Oh also, Chris Mathews just compared Bernie winning Nevada to the Nazis taking France. Whatever- bring it on. Trump's gonna go there anyways. Better that it happen now.