Political Discussion

Indymisanthrope said:
It's just a little mnemonic device to help you out anytime you start thinking, "Hey, isn't this exactly the type of thing he was chastising other candidates about doing?" Don't be silly -- it's okay if Bernie does it!
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Your analogy is broken. Or at least- it fails to understand Sander's supporters (and perhaps the man himself).

Most Sanders supporters do not view corporate Dems like Biden as being a part of the same team. We might swallow our vomit and vote for the guy because the other option is Trump, but somebody who is fighting us on Medicare for All, student debt relief, the seriousness of climate change, marijuana legalization and the such is NOT on my team.

88958469_10159161295066037_8348976464154066944_o.jpg

This image (which was shared by a Warren supporter on my FB feed) might be a touch hyperbolic, but the reality is that Joe is anti-progress. And for many, our hopes and desires for this country have not been lowered (by Trump) to the point where anybody who might be able to get rid of Donald suddenly = the same team. See Romney, Mitt.

All of this to say- the reason Sander's supporters got so wound up over the Warren thing is because we viewed her as the same team. Her and Sanders align on almost all matters related to policy, and we viewed her end goal as (for the most part) our goal. Which is why I cared far more about stopping Joe than I did who would be the nominee between Warren and Sanders. And why she has been criticized the way she has.

In contrast, it is currently Sanders job to push Biden as far to the left as possible. Which, at the very least, means not dropping out until after the debate even though everyone involved knows the primary is all but wrapped up. Also-- just like last time, Bernie staying in the race allows him to rack up more delegates and influence the platform at the convention. Because a Biden presidency needs to look more like a team Sander's supporters want to join-- or a lot of them will stay home. Maybe that won't matter and it can be made up via suburban voters. Maybe it will.

But right now my Facebook wall is full of people sharing this quote:

“First, I must confess that over the last few years I have been gravely disappointed with the white moderate. I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro's great stumbling block in the stride toward freedom is not the White Citizen's Council-er or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate who is more devoted to "order" than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice; who constantly says "I agree with you in the goal you seek, but I can't agree with your methods of direct action;" who paternalistically feels he can set the timetable for another man's freedom; who lives by the myth of time and who constantly advises the Negro to wait until a "more convenient season."

- MLK

Now- of course- the irony is that it's largely been older black voters pushing Joe towards the nomination. But that doesn't change the fact that I am already seeing certain circles (particularly my Latino friends) who are pushing the idea that "maybe middle class whites need to suffer more before they will the light"-- even after the past four years have shown the dangers of that assessment.
 
DownIsTheNewUp said:
Your analogy is broken. Or at least- it fails to understand Sander's supporters (and perhaps the man himself).

Most Sanders supporters do not view corporate Dems like Biden as being a part of the same team. We might swallow our vomit and vote for the guy because the other option is Trump, but somebody who is fighting us on Medicare for All, student debt relief, the seriousness of climate change, marijuana legalization and the such is NOT on my team.

View attachment 36052

This image (which was shared by a Warren supporter on my FB feed) might be a touch hyperbolic, but the reality is that Joe is anti-progress. And for many, our hopes and desires for this country have not been lowered (by Trump) to the point where anybody who might be able to get rid of Donald suddenly = the same team. See Romney, Mitt.

All of this to say- the reason Sander's supporters got so wound up over the Warren thing is because we viewed her as the same team. Her and Sanders align on almost all matters related to policy, and we viewed her end goal as (for the most part) our goal. Which is why I cared far more about stopping Joe than I did who would be the nominee between Warren and Sanders. And why she has been criticized the way she has.

In contrast, it is currently Sanders job to push Biden as far to the left as possible. Which, at the very least, means not dropping out until after the debate even though everyone involved knows it over (barring a miracle). And just like last time, Bernie staying in the race allows him to rack up more delegates and influence the platform at the convention. Because a Biden presidency needs to look more like a team Sander's supporters want to join-- or a lot of them will stay home. Maybe that won't matter and it can be made up via suburban voters.

But right now my Facebook wall is full of people sharing this quote:

“First, I must confess that over the last few years I have been gravely disappointed with the white moderate. I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro's great stumbling block in the stride toward freedom is not the White Citizen's Council-er or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate who is more devoted to "order" than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice; who constantly says "I agree with you in the goal you seek, but I can't agree with your methods of direct action;" who paternalistically feels he can set the timetable for another man's freedom; who lives by the myth of time and who constantly advises the Negro to wait until a "more convenient season."

- MLK

Now- of course- the irony is that it's largely been older black voters pushing Joe towards the nomination. But that doesn't change the fact that I am already seeing certain circles (particularly my Latino friends) who are pushing the idea that "maybe middle class whites need to suffer more before they will the light"-- even after the past four years have shown the dangers of that assessment.
Click to expand...
Seriously, read this piece. I think it might help you come around to the idea that Biden might not end up being as terrible as you think it would be.

Opinion | This Is Not the Moment for Progressives to Despair
 
DownIsTheNewUp said:
Your analogy is broken. Or at least- it fails to understand Sander's supporters (and perhaps the man himself).

Most Sanders supporters do not view corporate Dems like Biden as being a part of the same team. We might swallow our vomit and vote for the guy because the other option is Trump, but somebody who is fighting us on Medicare for All, student debt relief, the seriousness of climate change, marijuana legalization and the such is NOT on my team.

View attachment 36052

This image (which was shared by a Warren supporter on my FB feed) might be a touch hyperbolic, but the reality is that Joe is anti-progress. And for many, our hopes and desires for this country have not been lowered (by Trump) to the point where anybody who might be able to get rid of Donald suddenly = the same team. See Romney, Mitt.

All of this to say- the reason Sander's supporters got so wound up over the Warren thing is because we viewed her as the same team. Her and Sanders align on almost all matters related to policy, and we viewed her end goal as (for the most part) our goal. Which is why I cared far more about stopping Joe than I did who would be the nominee between Warren and Sanders. And why she has been criticized the way she has.

In contrast, it is currently Sanders job to push Biden as far to the left as possible. Which, at the very least, means not dropping out until after the debate even though everyone involved knows the primary is all but wrapped up. Also-- just like last time, Bernie staying in the race allows him to rack up more delegates and influence the platform at the convention. Because a Biden presidency needs to look more like a team Sander's supporters want to join-- or a lot of them will stay home. Maybe that won't matter and it can be made up via suburban voters. Maybe it will.

But right now my Facebook wall is full of people sharing this quote:

“First, I must confess that over the last few years I have been gravely disappointed with the white moderate. I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro's great stumbling block in the stride toward freedom is not the White Citizen's Council-er or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate who is more devoted to "order" than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice; who constantly says "I agree with you in the goal you seek, but I can't agree with your methods of direct action;" who paternalistically feels he can set the timetable for another man's freedom; who lives by the myth of time and who constantly advises the Negro to wait until a "more convenient season."

- MLK

Now- of course- the irony is that it's largely been older black voters pushing Joe towards the nomination. But that doesn't change the fact that I am already seeing certain circles (particularly my Latino friends) who are pushing the idea that "maybe middle class whites need to suffer more before they will the light"-- even after the past four years have shown the dangers of that assessment.
Click to expand...
That’s what I said. Mine was a lot shorter though.
 
TenderLovingKiller® said:
Yeah, I read this in the Washington Post yesterday great and important piece. People don’t even know how bad a shit show this could turn into.
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Solid article by the way. Not sure I buy it completely. Mostly because I think Biden will side with corporate America 99/100 times. But it's certainly what one has to hope for.
 
DownIsTheNewUp said:
Solid article by the way. Not sure I buy it completely. Mostly because I think Biden will side with corporate America 99/100 times. But it's certainly what one has to hope for.
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I liked the idea though, he is a Party guy ultimately if we change what the party represents (which in my ways we have) his views are certainly malleable enough to get more of a progressive agenda going forward, especially if he’s surrounded by a lot of progressive types in his cabinet.
 
Trump has suspended all travel to Europe with the exception of the UK.

There will be no people entering or leaving the US to and from Europe for the next 30 days to try to control coronavirus.
 
www.nytimes.com

Congress to Vote on Coronavirus Rescue Package (Published 2020)

Congress and the White House are nearing an economic rescue package; stocks plunged again Thursday despite the Fed offering at least $1.5 trillion worth of short-term loans to banks.
www.nytimes.com www.nytimes.com

Talks on a sweeping aid package stumble on paid sick leave and, improbably, abortion.

But another improbable sticking point has emerged: Republicans are trying to insert abortion restrictions into the emergency bill. The Republicans want to include the Hyde amendment, which would bar the use of federal funds for abortions, according to a person familiar with the deliberations. Republicans routinely push to include the language in legislation that governs the distribution of federal money.
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Of all the things to try to hijack. This is beyond despicable.

Edit:sorry that is a weird link with how they are doing it.
 
RenegadeMonster said:
www.theadvocate.com

Louisiana's presidential primary election to be delayed because of coronavirus

The presidential primary elections in Louisiana slated for April will be delayed by two months, the latest in a series of dramatic steps government leaders have taken to slow the
www.theadvocate.com www.theadvocate.com

This is just the start of it. I expect the primaries will likely be suspended.
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Hell naw. I'd start thinking pretty seriously of having people in Hazmat Suits going door to door if I were on the planning department of any state that hasn't done their primaries yet. No party can stand on the claiming they're listening to their people if we can't do elections. And Imma be angry if anyone tries to go for remote, electronic voting. That screams ballot stuffing.
 
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